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Auction System Minimum Bid Potential Abuse

Comments

  • GretaGreta
    Mabinogi Rep: 42,485
    Posts: 6,099
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    edited April 27, 2018
    As I've stated before, this is supposed to be an Auction House, where bids take place.
    If only a single bidder places the minumum bid, then the Auction is no longer an Auction, but classified as a general purchase.

    pZ8qfIc.gif

    MizukiHayamaBronzebreakWolfandWolfBlissfulkillGremm
  • WolfandWolfWolfandWolf
    Mabinogi Rep: 5,890
    Posts: 786
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    edited April 28, 2018
    But....it IS an auction where bids take place. It's just that there's only one bid in this instance..... o_o;

    The definition of an auction does not change with the number of bidders (or the lack thereof). It is the mechanism by which it is sold; so long as it is open to other people for the chance to jump in at any moment and place a bid, it is an auction (regardless if they choose to jump in or not).

    The actuality does not matter. So long as the possibility exists, it is an auction.
    MizukiHayamaYokkaichiAlchemistjkBlissfulkillGremm
  • MizukiHayamaMizukiHayama
    Mabinogi Rep: 2,465
    Posts: 185
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    But....it IS an auction where bids take place. It's just that there's only one bid in this instance..... o_o;

    The definition of an auction does not change with the number of bidders (or the lack thereof). It is the mechanism by which it is sold; so long as it is open to other people for the chance to jump in at any moment and place a bid, it is an auction (regardless if they choose to jump in or not).

    The actuality does not matter. So long as the possibility exists, it is an auction.

    ^This
    I have seen items go up in bid and ones that either died at the minimum, or purchased so.
    But yes, the idea of an auction is as such
    1. Put item for sale with a min starting bid and an auto win
    2. Wait for people to bid
    3. The winner receives the item.
    But of course, if only one person bids, that means only the one person is interested in the item. You can't go around saying it's exploit when that's basically WHAT an auction is.
    Set the minimum higher, at a price you are happy with and that is that.
    WolfandWolf
  • RheyRhey
    Mabinogi Rep: 9,835
    Posts: 1,474
    Member
    edited April 28, 2018
    When U undercut urself... don't be mad @ the system just cuz it let it go through.

    Gotta learn 2 set Ur bids smarter.

    Auction trolling would be a thing if this security measure is not in place.
    MizukiHayamaBronzebreakVeylaineGremm
  • BronzebreakBronzebreak
    Mabinogi Rep: 3,445
    Posts: 423
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    I refuse to believe that Dark is doing anything other than trolling at this point.


    Good luck, all.
    VeylaineGremm
  • Darkpixie99Darkpixie99
    Mabinogi Rep: 8,410
    Posts: 1,680
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    I refuse to believe that Dark is doing anything other than trolling at this point.


    Good luck, all.

    I'm being serious here.
    If an Auction House system is meant to engage an active auction process, then can encouraging one minimum bid really be called a working system?
    I don't think so.
  • FluoretteFluorette
    Mabinogi Rep: 3,330
    Posts: 407
    Member
    Again, there is nothing in the Auction House announcement promising an "active" auction process. If you would like your items to receive more attention, you can advertise it in the Party chat, bugle, etc. when you're online, like another poster here suggested.
    VeylaineGremm
  • MizukiHayamaMizukiHayama
    Mabinogi Rep: 2,465
    Posts: 185
    Member
    I refuse to believe that Dark is doing anything other than trolling at this point.


    Good luck, all.

    I'm being serious here.
    If an Auction House system is meant to engage an active auction process, then can encouraging one minimum bid really be called a working system?
    I don't think so.

    If people are not interested in said item, it is not the auction's fault. If I were to sell something old that most players had, and only one player bid, or none at all, should I go crying the system is flawed?
    The option of selling as an auction is not here to cater to your demands, it's not gonna create bids so that you can be satisfied; it all depends on the player base's needs.
    And it's not fair to give the option to the seller to cancel the bidding and take back the item as it would not be fair for a player to bid on something then back off of that because they found something cheaper.
    That's just how it is and how an auction works; Once you choose you commit whether you want to or not :/.
  • Darkpixie99Darkpixie99
    Mabinogi Rep: 8,410
    Posts: 1,680
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    Fluorette wrote: »
    Again, there is nothing in the Auction House announcement promising an "active" auction process. If you would like your items to receive more attention, you can advertise it in the Party chat, bugle, etc. when you're online, like another poster here suggested.

    Wow, you guys really can't think outside the box.
    Bidding only with a minimum bid is still directly abusing the way the system works.
    Aka, abusing a coded system that was just pushed over by Korea, with a much more active server, where such system abuse wouldn't occur.
    Henceforth, a "You must raise the minimum bid." notification should occur.
    Or at least some sort of in system acknowledgment that a bid has not been active within a 36 hour timespan to prevent such an abuse.
    An alert that notifies the player of inactive auctions, or automatic bid alerts.
  • WolfandWolfWolfandWolf
    Mabinogi Rep: 5,890
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    Fluorette wrote: »
    Again, there is nothing in the Auction House announcement promising an "active" auction process. If you would like your items to receive more attention, you can advertise it in the Party chat, bugle, etc. when you're online, like another poster here suggested.

    Wow, you guys really can't think outside the box.
    Bidding only with a minimum bid is still directly abusing the way the system works.
    Aka, abusing a coded system that was just pushed over by Korea, with a much more active server, where such system abuse wouldn't occur.
    Henceforth, a "You must raise the minimum bid." notification should occur.
    Or at least some sort of in system acknowledgment that a bid has not been active within a 36 hour timespan to prevent such an abuse.
    An alert that notifies the player of inactive auctions, or automatic bid alerts.

    Wha....t..? You....want to be able to raise....the minimum bid....AFTER the bidder has already placed a bid....?? So...you want to FORCE a bidder to pay HIGHER than they originally intended without their permission?

    That doesn't sound fair at all! It just sounds like you think you have some heavenly given right to go around taking people's money without their permission. The only way that could possibly be fair is if you give the bidders the ability to back out at the new price. Otherwise...no, no I DON'T support your idea.
    VeylaineGretaAlchemistjkDaktaroGremm
  • GretaGreta
    Mabinogi Rep: 42,485
    Posts: 6,099
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    Fluorette wrote: »
    Again, there is nothing in the Auction House announcement promising an "active" auction process. If you would like your items to receive more attention, you can advertise it in the Party chat, bugle, etc. when you're online, like another poster here suggested.

    Wow, you guys really can't think outside the box.
    Bidding only with a minimum bid is still directly abusing the way the system works.
    Aka, abusing a coded system that was just pushed over by Korea, with a much more active server, where such system abuse wouldn't occur.
    Henceforth, a "You must raise the minimum bid." notification should occur.
    Or at least some sort of in system acknowledgment that a bid has not been active within a 36 hour timespan to prevent such an abuse.
    An alert that notifies the player of inactive auctions, or automatic bid alerts.

    Or it's you who thinks outside of the box way too much.
    Alchemistjk
  • GremmGremm
    Mabinogi Rep: 1,840
    Posts: 184
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    edited April 29, 2018
    Gremm wrote: »
    You've been complaining a lot that only one bidder was interested in your items

    We have already told you that there is no fault in neither the bidder nor the system
    As I've stated before, this is supposed to be an Auction House, where bids take place.
    If only a single bidder places the minumum bid, then the Auction is no longer an Auction, but classified as a general purchase.
    This changes the function of the Auction system entirely, and no longer brings forth any proper execution for players to see a reason to up the bid to win the item.
    Instead, they'll lazily place a minimum bid, and wait three days for time to run out.
    This has happened on not one, but several of my auctioned items.

    Nope, it seems that you still don't understand how an auction works, its called an auction because multiple bidders can bid on an item they want/need, even if only one bidder place the bid then its still classified as an auction, it doesn't mean that the auction is classified as a general purchase just because no other players are interested in your offered items.

    And people aren't lazy when only placing the minimum bid since you're the one that placed that bid to begin with, why would anyone raise the bid if they don't need to? That is just stupid and i still cant hear any reason or logic in your arguments here, there are just complains that you cant deal with the auction and that no one wants to place a higher bid for you.
    This has happened on not one, but several of my auctioned items.

    If you think there is a problem with the auction house, why are you still using it? It wont change anything since there is no problem to begin with.
    MizukiHayamaAlchemistjk
  • FluoretteFluorette
    Mabinogi Rep: 3,330
    Posts: 407
    Member

    Leaving that remark aside... The suggestion for the notification, bid alerts, and other specifics would have been a nice addition in the first post here, since as it is, the first post doesn't mention any clear steps that can be made to improve the Auction House to entice a more active system, but rather, focuses on abuse hence why the posters here have reacted the way they have--and that way would be informing you on how an auction works and whatnot.
    Alchemistjk
  • AlchemistjkAlchemistjk
    Mabinogi Rep: 940
    Posts: 17
    Member
    edited April 29, 2018
    "You must raise the minimum bid" notification is completely one sided. The buyer/bidder has also had their bid money frozen - what if a similar item had been offered by someone else, but x hours later when the seller/system decides to change the min bid amount the whole transaction is cancelled? The other item is already sold. The bidders time and money is not important? It is to them. :( In fact they made a commitment to the price you chose and now if they see it for less they can't just decide to back out.
  • Darkpixie99Darkpixie99
    Mabinogi Rep: 8,410
    Posts: 1,680
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    Wha....t..? You....want to be able to raise....the minimum bid....AFTER the bidder has already placed a bid....?? So...you want to FORCE a bidder to pay HIGHER than they originally intended without their permission?

    That doesn't sound fair at all! It just sounds like you think you have some heavenly given right to go around taking people's money without their permission. The only way that could possibly be fair is if you give the bidders the ability to back out at the new price. Otherwise...no, no I DON'T support your idea.

    You people act as if you've never seen an error message before.
    -Bidder enters minimum bid
    -No money is withdrawn from the bank
    -Bidder receives error message: "You must raise the minimum bid to begin the Auction Process."
    Honestly, this shouldn't be a problem. I've seen numbers like 200k go to simply 217,222.
    Unless Nexon NA actually caps out how much each bid up can go, then players can still bid with anarchy on more or less deserted market servers.
  • BlissfulkillBlissfulkill
    Mabinogi Rep: 23,405
    Posts: 2,713
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    Greta wrote: »
    As I've stated before, this is supposed to be an Auction House, where bids take place.
    If only a single bidder places the minumum bid, then the Auction is no longer an Auction, but classified as a general purchase.

    pZ8qfIc.gif

    Greta already posted my a visual display of my exasperation, but I felt I need to reinforce the collective groaning I hear.

    3cd8a33a.png
    But....it IS an auction where bids take place. It's just that there's only one bid in this instance..... o_o;

    The definition of an auction does not change with the number of bidders (or the lack thereof). It is the mechanism by which it is sold; so long as it is open to other people for the chance to jump in at any moment and place a bid, it is an auction (regardless if they choose to jump in or not).

    The actuality does not matter. So long as the possibility exists, it is an auction.

    I love you, for this line of reasoning I wholeheartedly agree with.
    MizukiHayamaGretaWolfandWolf
  • CrimsCrims
    Mabinogi Rep: 45,630
    Posts: 6,902
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    edited April 30, 2018
    wat.jpg

    Wat8.jpg?1315930535

    It's not abuse...just...god...sell it for what you want! XD

    I mean seriously, you can do a range bid. Like lets say the item you want to sell is worth 5-10m. Well then you would make the STARTING bid 5m and the auto 10m. Also if your auction item only sells for 1m...well then perhaps your item is not really in demand is only worth 1m.

    There is no abuse, you just don't get the concept of what auction is or how markets work.
    Daktaro
  • DaktaroDaktaro
    Mabinogi Rep: 3,095
    Posts: 280
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    it's not abuse that's just how auctions work

    like other people said, if there's only one bid on your thing at the end of it, it's still an auction. as soon as there's option to bid = an auction. just means either the min bid was too high for the market or not many people were interested, or both.

    you put the minimum bid at the very least amount you would ACCEPT for the item, any bids on top of it is a bonus
    if you put the min bid lower than you'd be happy to sell for that's your mistake :\
  • BlissfulkillBlissfulkill
    Mabinogi Rep: 23,405
    Posts: 2,713
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    edited May 1, 2018
    While someone can place a minimum bid, this means others have to bid above it, and by a certain percentage of the current bid amount. To which, I also say You are not entitled to the business of others! You are not entitled to having your items be actually being bidded on. You cannot foist interest on those uninterested, nor dissuade others from expressing an interest in whatever price.

    So essentially, tough luck kid.

    latest?cb=20141226002900

    I really do like being impolite for no reason, but your logic is baffling, and I surmise it to be simple entitlement. You appear to be acting as if the world owes it to you to bid on your items by the droves. No one has any responsibility to do so, especially due to how the pricing is set by you.

    Ah damn, misread what the last post is, thought OP brought it up. Darn, I could have let this thread die.
  • GremmGremm
    Mabinogi Rep: 1,840
    Posts: 184
    Member
    edited May 3, 2018
    Fluorette wrote: »
    Again, there is nothing in the Auction House announcement promising an "active" auction process. If you would like your items to receive more attention, you can advertise it in the Party chat, bugle, etc. when you're online, like another poster here suggested.

    Wow, you guys really can't think outside the box.
    Bidding only with a minimum bid is still directly abusing the way the system works.
    Aka, abusing a coded system that was just pushed over by Korea, with a much more active server, where such system abuse wouldn't occur.
    Henceforth, a "You must raise the minimum bid." notification should occur.
    Or at least some sort of in system acknowledgment that a bid has not been active within a 36 hour timespan to prevent such an abuse.
    An alert that notifies the player of inactive auctions, or automatic bid alerts.

    I don't think you have the right to say that we can't think outside of the box, we have explained to you over and over again how the system and the auction works many times over yet you just keep on repeating the same line over and over again like a broken recorder with no valid reason whatsoever except what you think should work the way you want it to.

    You cant just force several bidders to magically appear to place bids on your items just for your own ego's sake, that is not how an auction is supposed to work. There is a minimum bid and other players can raise the bid, as long as that function is in place its called an auction, even if only one player is bidding on the item its still an auction, it doesn't automatically turn into a general purchase, it is still an auction as long as one can raise the bid.
    I refuse to believe that Dark is doing anything other than trolling at this point.


    Good luck, all.

    Im starting to believe that as well since i can't find any proper arguments in Darkpixie99's comments (nor any existing problems) :/