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Can we not immediately scream for nerfs?

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  • AlshianAlshian
    Mabinogi Rep: 6,420
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    Promestein wrote: »
    My only bone to pick would be the final boss and the weird camera angle. I lost because of it

    same goes for me, the camera angle while using the new trans needs to be worked on so that i don't have to look up to see what i am fighting against something.
  • LeineiLeinei
    Mabinogi Rep: 13,710
    Posts: 2,231
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    edited July 12, 2018
    Leinei wrote: »
    HOLY MOLY, I think I'm at the final boss of Part 2 and it's a little crazy.

    Ok, I'm not at the final boss, but it's still crazy.

    Bit of a random question. Do Poison Potions work on anything in this part?
  • LunarxpherLunarxpher
    Mabinogi Rep: 615
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    Teases wrote: »
    Or, you can just chain cast firebolt and win. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

    doesn't work with stupid regen rate.
  • tunafishytunafishy
    Mabinogi Rep: 540
    Posts: 2
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    Honestly this last boss is just terribly designed. Its not challenging and fun. Its just ridiculously strong to the point where you get instantly slapped. It has ridiculous HP and ridiculous damage. Thats not how you make a challenging boss. This is just artificial difficulty.
    FOXAssassinAeolys
  • IyasenuIyasenu
    Mabinogi Rep: 22,550
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    Alshian wrote: »
    Promestein wrote: »
    My only bone to pick would be the final boss and the weird camera angle. I lost because of it

    same goes for me, the camera angle while using the new trans needs to be worked on so that i don't have to look up to see what i am fighting against something.

    I think KR got a change like this.

    Something about "large characters camera".

    If anything, it should affect Nascent Divinity and stuff like... you ever played as a Fallen Fairy? Like manually?
    Or maybe certain Transformation Mastery monster transformations. They also can have wonky cameras due to their weird sizes.
  • ZephyrmaruZephyrmaru
    Mabinogi Rep: 2,430
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    People who die: This boss killed me and is hard to get over, therefore it is terribly designed because I wanted to beat the whole content in a day and return to afking without wasting any pots/nao stones.

    That is next level pathetic, gotta say xD

    Like, I have no problems whatsoever with casual players. In fact, I think it's an extremely healthy and mature way to pace yourself in MMOs when you have a job/work/other commitments. But a casual shouldn't be arguing 4 hours into release that the FINAL BOSS is hard. And if the people complaining are not casuals....git gud?

    Yeah...git gud. Or borrow my copy of Kirby's Epic Yarn if you can't handle it : ^ )
  • LeineiLeinei
    Mabinogi Rep: 13,710
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    Zephyrmaru wrote: »
    People who die: This boss killed me and is hard to get over, therefore it is terribly designed because I wanted to beat the whole content in a day and return to afking without wasting any pots/nao stones.

    That is next level pathetic, gotta say xD

    Like, I have no problems whatsoever with casual players. In fact, I think it's an extremely healthy and mature way to pace yourself in MMOs when you have a job/work/other commitments. But a casual shouldn't be arguing 4 hours into release that the FINAL BOSS is hard. And if the people complaining are not casuals....git gud?

    Yeah...git gud. Or borrow my copy of Kirby's Epic Yarn if you can't handle it : ^ )

    Personally, my only main gripe was the one with the 50000% recovery rate because it's an insane fight. Doesn't help I kept crashing while trying to get Pets out and away.
  • ZephyrmaruZephyrmaru
    Mabinogi Rep: 2,430
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    Not sure if this helps you, but I sometimes have the pet summoning lag problem. I task manager'd and found my comp was updating something in the background cause there to be a tiny bit of visible lag, but a ton of background lag. Unless this is something happening every day, you might be able to fix it if you try cleaning your comp processes.

    Good luck o/
  • XiokunXiokun
    Mabinogi Rep: 11,050
    Posts: 887
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    I'm seeing a lot of frustration and words that can really start some arguments. I'd recommend avoiding speech that can insult people for their opinion, be it insulting those who think it's to easy, or insulting those who think it's too hard. At the end of the day we're all players trying to play the same game and have a nice time, so let's try to be civil before another thread collapses into flames. :S

    I feel that Mabinogi combat in general has drifted into being more focused on damage, gear, and pets than the kind of strategies I was used to back when I first joined. It killed combat for me in general, making me stay just for my friends and clothes. I wasn't willing to spend more time than I felt was necessary grinding gold for near 20m+ gears, pets, reforges, or maxing out every skill to Master or Dan 3 in order to do dungeons in a timely manner and/or rushed manner, so I gave up after a while. I didn't find it too rewarding. Overall, it looks to me like combat is almost all the same, but with much larger HP, and perhaps some instant kill skills in the monsters that only make the battles more frustrating. I haven't played the new generation yet, though after seeing how Sidhe- (I forget how to spell it, the one in Abb Neagh) played out, and how Rabbie Phanstam is like, I would only assume that the harder generations moving forward will only take minor gear and strategy adjustments, but the HP pool getting bigger and bigger, geared toward the strongest of the strong, while leaving the weaker content, like those mobs in Iria walking around the snow, deserts, and woods, forgotten and in the dust. It's too late to fix any of this now. We're too far up the power ladder now, and we can only go up. :/
    3rdyNeroyImaizumiVeylaineMizukiHayamaFOXAssassinSelenijaRadiant DawnSheenaAeolysand 1 other.
  • NinzerkerNinzerker
    Mabinogi Rep: 1,640
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    >get gud
    >almost 10 mastered talents
    >below 850 hit points max
    >Tagar hits 900 every attack
    >elf improved move speed, +1%totem +3titles +15-17% march song
    >still hit by 40% of attacks
    >don't have Wave racer and fleet feet but near max move speed not helping with evasion much
    >constant attack doesn't leave time for retaliation beyond few whip hits
    >2 pillars, bone drag debuff, dance of death debuff, shoryuken debuff, on top of fantastic chorus debuff
    >4.6% damage crit impale
    >2%
    Why isn't the defeat screen auto opening the cash shop when its so heavily tailored to end game reforges and soul stone spam and speed potions
    If it was a matter of skill or ability THEN it would warrant a "Get Gud"
    FOXAssassinSelenijaEdetha
  • NeroyNeroy
    Mabinogi Rep: 1,330
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    Promestein wrote: »
    My only bone to pick would be the final boss and the weird camera angle. I lost because of it

    The camera was annoying but in overall, if you play like an oldschool player this wasnt really that hard of a storyline
  • nevyn25nevyn25
    Mabinogi Rep: 4,135
    Posts: 667
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    edited July 12, 2018
    Ninzerker wrote: »
    >get gud
    >almost 10 mastered talents
    >below 850 hit points max
    >Tagar hits 900 every attack
    >elf improved move speed, +1%totem +3titles +15-17% march song
    >still hit by 40% of attacks
    >don't have Wave racer and fleet feet but near max move speed not helping with evasion much
    >constant attack doesn't leave time for retaliation beyond few whip hits
    >2 pillars, bone drag debuff, dance of death debuff, shoryuken debuff, on top of fantastic chorus debuff
    >4.6% damage crit impale
    >2%
    Why isn't the defeat screen auto opening the cash shop when its so heavily tailored to end game reforges and soul stone spam and speed potions
    If it was a matter of skill or ability THEN it would warrant a "Get Gud"

    basically this. I mean, I'm one of the few players who doesn't complain about not being able to one-shot mobs while at the same time complaining there's no challenging content. I like a challenge, but these bosses are ridiculous. their damage should be percentage based, so that players without reforged end-game gear can also reasonably defeat them
    VeylaineLongSlyFOXAssassinAeolys
  • NeroyNeroy
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    Donk3y wrote: »
    Also before somebody says that we shouldn't whine just because it's a bit hard... it's not just hard. It's stupidly hard to the point of it be very very much unfair towards the LARGE majority of players.

    A hard boss or a hard game doesn't mean it's badly designed. Making it bullsheet kind of hard for all the wrong reasons, making it utterly unfrair and not even giving you a chance, THAT is bad design.

    The best example of hard games that are very well designed are the dark souls games. Sure they do have a few bits and pieces that are just stupidly unfair (seath first encounter, anor londo archers, the blizzard place from ds2, etc.) but even those give you the tools required to pass them, and most importantly, you can deal with them rather easily after you've seen it once or twice.

    You just cannot say the same about this generaion. Oh sure, with maxed out archery on elf it's a walk in the park if you're extremely high level... Great, what if I'm neither? Sure, I'll just grind 4k more levels and max out that one particular skill set that will allow me to finish it, yeah, no pressure...

    ok dude chill i did was lure him to a corner and used my brionic(i thought it would have been one of those old school mission where using brionic 'the power infused to a weapon to kill a god' to cut def/prot but it still didnt but i was already got it at 80%hp as just went with it rip AP)to spam smash with a clouds fast attks to stop constant health regen and used like 10-30 300hp pots when it used shadow spirit, demi with wings of eclipse and trans helped A LOT. it took half an hour but hell explains the 90min time frame. Tbh i missed when you actually had to plan your fight insted of going reckless like every other SM or Raid.
    Hellkaizer
  • HellkaizerHellkaizer
    Mabinogi Rep: 11,065
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    Ninzerker wrote: »
    >get gud
    >almost 10 mastered talents Doesn't have manashield though?
    >below 850 hit points max
    >Tagar hits 900 every attack
    >elf improved move speed, +1%totem +3titles +15-17% march song I did this with base elf move speed and got hit like maybe 10% of the time.
    >still hit by 40% of attacks
    >don't have Wave racer and fleet feet but near max move speed not helping with evasion much
    >constant attack doesn't leave time for retaliation beyond few whip hits
    >2 pillars, bone drag debuff, dance of death debuff, shoryuken debuff, on top of fantastic chorus debuff
    >4.6% damage crit impale Brionac is a thing either, and someone posted a video how to cheese it anyway
    >2%
    Why isn't the defeat screen auto opening the cash shop when its so heavily tailored to end game reforges and soul stone spam and speed potions
    If it was a matter of skill or ability THEN it would warrant a "Get Gud"

    It does warrant a get gud because the first boss you can dodge all of its damage with anchor rush.

    Donk3y wrote: »
    The thing is the bosses in this generation are BY FAR the WORST designed bosses in mabinogi. Every other generation boss, even the EXTREMELY HARD ONES for their times gave you a fighting chance, but this one? Nope.

    People compared the doppleganger boss to glas... ok let me put it into perspective: A good analogy of how badly designed this boss is, is to consider glas. Now give him 1000x more HP...

    Sure there was one dude that said he killed it in 30 seconds... Great, wonder if I could do it with your 30k lvls...
    You shouldn't need literally end game gears and stats just to have a fighting chance in a STORYLINE boss.

    Unless there's some kind of convoluted trick to it, this boss is pure and simple BAD DESIGN.

    G1 Glas at the time was harder than the face to face fight, and you could fight it in a party. G1 Glas's most popular strat was to get it stuck on campfires so you could avoid his charge. So your analogy is baseless.


    I'm not trying to out anyone, or target anyone in saying this but there's a LOT of things you can do to make fights easier that varies from debuffing to just avoiding damage in general. Seeing this outrage is almost sad in a way. Somethings that are really awful though, the camera while in Nascent Divinity is pretty bad. It'd also be nice if we had more instructions for the different fights and such as they involve a bit of trial and error.
    OnyxRoyalty
  • ZephyrmaruZephyrmaru
    Mabinogi Rep: 2,430
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    edited July 12, 2018
    If you think those of us beating it have reforged gear, you're wrong LOL.

    As someone has said already, a lot of it is down to playing oldschool vs what we've grown accustomed to with power creep. We used to die to dps extremely quickly, and there weren't things like "tanking some hits". You can build up a ton of armor to get some wiggle room, but you can't just brainlessly mash content with ttlv and sp upgrades...wait yes you could before now :' )
    ImaizumiHellkaizer
  • nevyn25nevyn25
    Mabinogi Rep: 4,135
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    want good design? then take a look at any given final fantasy boss. THAT is good design. I mean, I totally agree the bosses, especially later gens, shouldn't be a breeze by just final hitting them to death in a few seconds. but barely being able to damage a boss whose attack range is bigger than divine link when it kills even the strongest players in 3-4 hits is not good design. as for a mabi example... the girg fight in realization is good design. it is hard, and may require a few nao stones, but it's very doable once you get the hang of it and fight strategically.
  • KouyioueKouyioue
    Mabinogi Rep: 3,290
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    edited July 12, 2018
    It seems that there's finally a reason to switch to neanheim powers

    When was the last time anyone ever used spear of god, let alone EQUIPPED brionac?
  • LeineiLeinei
    Mabinogi Rep: 13,710
    Posts: 2,231
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    edited July 12, 2018
    Zephyrmaru wrote: »
    Not sure if this helps you, but I sometimes have the pet summoning lag problem. I task manager'd and found my comp was updating something in the background cause there to be a tiny bit of visible lag, but a ton of background lag. Unless this is something happening every day, you might be able to fix it if you try cleaning your comp processes.

    Good luck o/

    Oddly, the issue was restricted to that mission only as far as I noticed (only crashed during that one). Never had an issue after that, but sadly I am forced to wait until later to see if there are more because my power decided to go out. -_-

    Also, Neamhain's power didn't do much for me at all, even the homing light missiles.
  • xDerpxxDerpx
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    Greta wrote: »
    All you need to do is have ton of Nao/Guardian Stones and you are good to go. Potions are a bonus. Thank you events (especially Treasure Hunt one).

    ^THIS lol
  • ImaizumiImaizumi
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    To everyone taking 900s from Tagar... I'm ttlv 20k and took 400-700s. Then I put on my rka set and a set of droseras and a kite shield and activated defense every time she jumped to me. Took 100s from there and with cloud spam it's a literal breeze beyond trying to get the pillars to fall on her.

    Not to say it's easy since 100-300 is still a lot of damage to some lower level players, but it's much more manageable at least. If you don't have anchor rush but have some decent armor lying around it should be easier hopefully!