Check out all of the details of this month's Patch Notes, featuring the 16th Anniversary and VIP Renewal Update! https://mabinogi.nexon.net/news/90098/16th-anniversary-and-vip-renewal-patch-notes-march-14th
[NEW MILLETIANS] Please note that all new forum users have to be approved before posting. This process can take up to 24 hours, and we appreciate your patience.
If this is your first visit, be sure to check out the Nexon Forums Code of Conduct. You have to register before you can post, so you can log in or create a forum name above to proceed. Thank you for your visit!

Merge Alexina

Comments

  • KensamaofmariKensamaofmari
    Mabinogi Rep: 34,745
    Posts: 7,909
    Member
    noobodyzxz wrote: »
    why merge?

    Because the soul stream wills it.
  • GretaGreta
    Mabinogi Rep: 51,805
    Posts: 6,975
    Member
    edited September 15, 2020
    noobodyzxz wrote: »
    Just go and transfer to Nao
    dont drag us into the complicated world of getting merged
    Alexina is doing fine as it is
    claiming Alexina and Nao as database clusters and channels are servers doesn't make any difference
    same problems will still happened and even if they get resolved there will always be someone who would find faults and complain
    nobody has time for this merge why waste time for this merge spamming post
    I'm too lazy to argue with this
    I did my best and done my research
    I'll just flag this as petition and spamming everytime it gets posted
    and since its an old topic being revisited over and over It could also be considered necrobumping
    I've decided to stop throwing stones on the hive and just drag it down
    I'll definitely get stinged alot

    Wow, showing real colors there aren't ya? Not really smart thoughts as well. This thread can't be counted as spam or necro-bumping, you have no idea, do you?
  • HelsaHelsa
    Mabinogi Rep: 23,380
    Posts: 5,764
    Member
    WOT WARNING
    Unfortunately, there won't be a merge happening anytime soon and the main culprit for this is paid name change and the way the database is set up; more on that later. The merge of 2019 happened because the three original servers had dangerously declined and declining activity. At present, the level of activity on Alexina is noticeably less than it was pre-merge but is still greater that what it was on the most active of the other servers just before the merge. So, under that way of thinking Alexina does not presently have bad enough numbers to merge it. Why, in the first place, Alexina was left out and why the game was launched as a multi-server offering rather than a single many channel version has never been made clear by Nexon. They are notoriously opaque about such things so what can you do except speculate.

    When the 2019 merge happened there was a massive cockerel-up with respect to duplicate names. This is because the game uses character name with server of residence as our character record's primary key. Primary Key's have to be unique for every record in the database. When the servers were merged records containing duplicate names, which had existed copacetically on different servers, were no long unique. So, the "+server" tag was appended to character names to make them unique once more. Some folks had aesthetic issues with this and Nexon responded by offering free, and then paid, name change. If a final merge were to happen now, it would follow the same process as the previous merge giving two scenarios:
    1) Since the residents of Nao had already had to withstand the naming issues, then their names are declared inviolate and Alexina characters only would have tags applied. This would be unfair to Alexina characters since they would be denied any chance at getting their unmodified name back, post merge, through the lottery that Nao users went through.
    2) The merge happens just as it did before with "+Nao" and "+Alexina" tags being applied. This would be unfair to Nao characters as they would have to be put in jeopardy yet another time.
    This is a zero-sum situation where someone loses. But it's worse than that. Because of paid name change, people on Nao AND Alexina have purchased names. But what about names people have paid for, are they exempt? Nexon would have to add a hidden field to each character record to indicate if it is a paid-for name. That should not be an impossible task. From their purchase records they should be able to reconstruct the data. Both the Paid Name Change text and the Name Change text say nothing about Nexon retaining the right to alter a purchased name of their own accord. But what if two different people have bought the same name on both servers then it is impossible to reconcile this situation. In other words, as things presently stand, merging Alexina, to be nice, is going to step on toes. This is why myself and others said that a partial and incomplete merge was the worst-case scenario. Once again Nexon is opaque on this.

    All finger pointing aside, what happens then if Alexina's numbers dwindle to critical ones? Given paid name change, CAN Nexon merge Alexina in? The answer is yes. There are two reasons:
    1) The Terms of Service and End User License Agreement section on indemnities (section VIII) allows them to because it makes it clear that even though you paid for your name you don't own the character sequence that populates the name field of your character record.
    2) There is already an establish precedent for Nexon altering paid-for names. When you create a character with a paid-for character card you have paid for that character, including it's name. Such characters had their names altered in the 2019 merge, establishing a precedent.
    So, while the database is set-up as it is Nexon is not going to merge Alexina in unless it has to, and if it has to it will.

    Moving forward Nexon can move away from using character name and server of residence as the primary key to, say, record number. Record numbers are unique. Of course this will require work including new code. Completed this would allow Nexon to merge without issue, but it would also allow for unlimited renaming. This would dramatically change the market size for name change since anyone and everyone could be called Goku or Kitsune or whatever. Hear that Nexon? MORE MONEY!!!!
    CrimsọnWolfsingerShakayaSherribubbascal
  • CrimsọnCrimsọn
    Mabinogi Rep: 65,165
    Posts: 9,159
    Member
    edited September 15, 2020
    Helsa wrote: »
    WOT WARNING
    Unfortunately, there won't be a merge happening anytime soon and the main culprit for this is paid name change and the way the database is set up; more on that later. The merge of 2019 happened because the three original servers had dangerously declined and declining activity. At present, the level of activity on Alexina is noticeably less than it was pre-merge but is still greater that what it was on the most active of the other servers just before the merge. So, under that way of thinking Alexina does not presently have bad enough numbers to merge it. Why, in the first place, Alexina was left out and why the game was launched as a multi-server offering rather than a single many channel version has never been made clear by Nexon. They are notoriously opaque about such things so what can you do except speculate.

    When the 2019 merge happened there was a massive cockerel-up with respect to duplicate names. This is because the game uses character name with server of residence as our character record's primary key. Primary Key's have to be unique for every record in the database. When the servers were merged records containing duplicate names, which had existed copacetically on different servers, were no long unique. So, the "+server" tag was appended to character names to make them unique once more. Some folks had aesthetic issues with this and Nexon responded by offering free, and then paid, name change. If a final merge were to happen now, it would follow the same process as the previous merge giving two scenarios:
    1) Since the residents of Nao had already had to withstand the naming issues, then their names are declared inviolate and Alexina characters only would have tags applied. This would be unfair to Alexina characters since they would be denied any chance at getting their unmodified name back, post merge, through the lottery that Nao users went through.
    2) The merge happens just as it did before with "+Nao" and "+Alexina" tags being applied. This would be unfair to Nao characters as they would have to be put in jeopardy yet another time.
    This is a zero-sum situation where someone loses. But it's worse than that. Because of paid name change, people on Nao AND Alexina have purchased names. But what about names people have paid for, are they exempt? Nexon would have to add a hidden field to each character record to indicate if it is a paid-for name. That should not be an impossible task. From their purchase records they should be able to reconstruct the data. Both the Paid Name Change text and the Name Change text say nothing about Nexon retaining the right to alter a purchased name of their own accord. But what if two different people have bought the same name on both servers then it is impossible to reconcile this situation. In other words, as things presently stand, merging Alexina, to be nice, is going to step on toes. This is why myself and others said that a partial and incomplete merge was the worst-case scenario. Once again Nexon is opaque on this.

    All finger pointing aside, what happens then if Alexina's numbers dwindle to critical ones? Given paid name change, CAN Nexon merge Alexina in? The answer is yes. There are two reasons:
    1) The Terms of Service and End User License Agreement section on indemnities (section VIII) allows them to because it makes it clear that even though you paid for your name you don't own the character sequence that populates the name field of your character record.
    2) There is already an establish precedent for Nexon altering paid-for names. When you create a character with a paid-for character card you have paid for that character, including it's name. Such characters had their names altered in the 2019 merge, establishing a precedent.
    So, while the database is set-up as it is Nexon is not going to merge Alexina in unless it has to, and if it has to it will.

    Moving forward Nexon can move away from using character name and server of residence as the primary key to, say, record number. Record numbers are unique. Of course this will require work including new code. Completed this would allow Nexon to merge without issue, but it would also allow for unlimited renaming. This would dramatically change the market size for name change since anyone and everyone could be called Goku or Kitsune or whatever. Hear that Nexon? MORE MONEY!!!!

    Oh right...oh crap. I didn't think of that. There were people who used the PAID name change service on Nao. Yeah they are right, this would essentially rip them off of that money. Now they can never merge Alexina, unless Alexina is willing to forfeit their ign's entirely. rip.

    And we can't do the last solution because reputations would be on the line. rip rip rip. smh.
    WolfsingerHelsa
  • GretaGreta
    Mabinogi Rep: 51,805
    Posts: 6,975
    Member
    Hooray!
  • BronzebreakBronzebreak
    Mabinogi Rep: 3,940
    Posts: 489
    Member
    noobodyzxz wrote: »
    Crimsọn wrote: »
    KgVelqO.jpg

    Hm...I think they want to be merged?

    the consistency of pixels in tables and chairs facing same angle gives away the fact that this was edited
    but ill give them an E for effort

    It's because they're trying to cover up the fact that it originally said 'PURGE ALEXINA'.
  • HelsaHelsa
    Mabinogi Rep: 23,380
    Posts: 5,764
    Member
    Crimsọn wrote: »
    Helsa wrote: »
    WOT WARNING
    Unfortunately, there won't be a merge happening anytime soon and the main culprit for this is paid name change and the way the database is set up; more on that later. The merge of 2019 happened because the three original servers had dangerously declined and declining activity. At present, the level of activity on Alexina is noticeably less than it was pre-merge but is still greater that what it was on the most active of the other servers just before the merge. So, under that way of thinking Alexina does not presently have bad enough numbers to merge it. Why, in the first place, Alexina was left out and why the game was launched as a multi-server offering rather than a single many channel version has never been made clear by Nexon. They are notoriously opaque about such things so what can you do except speculate.

    When the 2019 merge happened there was a massive cockerel-up with respect to duplicate names. This is because the game uses character name with server of residence as our character record's primary key. Primary Key's have to be unique for every record in the database. When the servers were merged records containing duplicate names, which had existed copacetically on different servers, were no long unique. So, the "+server" tag was appended to character names to make them unique once more. Some folks had aesthetic issues with this and Nexon responded by offering free, and then paid, name change. If a final merge were to happen now, it would follow the same process as the previous merge giving two scenarios:
    1) Since the residents of Nao had already had to withstand the naming issues, then their names are declared inviolate and Alexina characters only would have tags applied. This would be unfair to Alexina characters since they would be denied any chance at getting their unmodified name back, post merge, through the lottery that Nao users went through.
    2) The merge happens just as it did before with "+Nao" and "+Alexina" tags being applied. This would be unfair to Nao characters as they would have to be put in jeopardy yet another time.
    This is a zero-sum situation where someone loses. But it's worse than that. Because of paid name change, people on Nao AND Alexina have purchased names. But what about names people have paid for, are they exempt? Nexon would have to add a hidden field to each character record to indicate if it is a paid-for name. That should not be an impossible task. From their purchase records they should be able to reconstruct the data. Both the Paid Name Change text and the Name Change text say nothing about Nexon retaining the right to alter a purchased name of their own accord. But what if two different people have bought the same name on both servers then it is impossible to reconcile this situation. In other words, as things presently stand, merging Alexina, to be nice, is going to step on toes. This is why myself and others said that a partial and incomplete merge was the worst-case scenario. Once again Nexon is opaque on this.

    All finger pointing aside, what happens then if Alexina's numbers dwindle to critical ones? Given paid name change, CAN Nexon merge Alexina in? The answer is yes. There are two reasons:
    1) The Terms of Service and End User License Agreement section on indemnities (section VIII) allows them to because it makes it clear that even though you paid for your name you don't own the character sequence that populates the name field of your character record.
    2) There is already an establish precedent for Nexon altering paid-for names. When you create a character with a paid-for character card you have paid for that character, including it's name. Such characters had their names altered in the 2019 merge, establishing a precedent.
    So, while the database is set-up as it is Nexon is not going to merge Alexina in unless it has to, and if it has to it will.

    Moving forward Nexon can move away from using character name and server of residence as the primary key to, say, record number. Record numbers are unique. Of course this will require work including new code. Completed this would allow Nexon to merge without issue, but it would also allow for unlimited renaming. This would dramatically change the market size for name change since anyone and everyone could be called Goku or Kitsune or whatever. Hear that Nexon? MORE MONEY!!!!

    Oh right...oh crap. I didn't think of that. There were people who used the PAID name change service on Nao. Yeah they are right, this would essentially rip them off of that money. Now they can never merge Alexina, unless Alexina is willing to forfeit their ign's entirely. rip.

    And we can't do the last solution because reputations would be on the line. rip rip rip. smh.

    The ToSEULA is clear, Nexon can do whatever it wants, but whatever it does and however it does it will result in belly-aching from someone. Even the solution where they alter how the database is set up will result in complaints as some folks won't like that their name is no longer unique; I consider this the least troubling, overall, of all the scenarios. If Nexon was to make the necessary changes, as I outlined, then a merge is a nothing-burger. They could even make the merge using the 2019 method, either scenario, if they also announced that soon afterwards unlimited naming would come into effect, then the whole naming inconvenience thing would only be temporary.
  • CrimsọnCrimsọn
    Mabinogi Rep: 65,165
    Posts: 9,159
    Member
    Well I sure as hell am not giving up my name. I wanted this name for over a decade. If we go through another merge I'm gonna have to schedule two days off like I did before in order to get this name. In a way Crimson costed me two days of pay. I won't give it up.
    KensamaofmariHelsa
  • KensamaofmariKensamaofmari
    Mabinogi Rep: 34,745
    Posts: 7,909
    Member
    Crimsọn wrote: »
    Well I sure as hell am not giving up my name. I wanted this name for over a decade. If we go through another merge I'm gonna have to schedule two days off like I did before in order to get this name. In a way Crimson costed me two days of pay. I won't give it up.

    Yeah, those on Nao already shouldn't have to go through the name change process again. If they need it, buy it.
    PlatinaKoki
  • CrimsọnCrimsọn
    Mabinogi Rep: 65,165
    Posts: 9,159
    Member
    edited September 16, 2020
    Crimsọn wrote: »
    Well I sure as hell am not giving up my name. I wanted this name for over a decade. If we go through another merge I'm gonna have to schedule two days off like I did before in order to get this name. In a way Crimson costed me two days of pay. I won't give it up.

    Yeah, those on Nao already shouldn't have to go through the name change process again. If they need it, buy it.

    And we can't have duplicate names with unique serials because reputations would be put at risk from trollers. Basically we can't have a dozen Crimsons running around. :D
    KensamaofmariHelsa
  • HelsaHelsa
    Mabinogi Rep: 23,380
    Posts: 5,764
    Member
    edited September 16, 2020
    Crimsọn wrote: »
    Well I sure as hell am not giving up my name. I wanted this name for over a decade. If we go through another merge I'm gonna have to schedule two days off like I did before in order to get this name. In a way Crimson costed me two days of pay. I won't give it up.

    Yeah, those on Nao already shouldn't have to go through the name change process again. If they need it, buy it.

    That is a completely reasonable idea but at the same time since Alexina was left out of the 2019 merge it would mean they would have no chance at their name, after a final merge, in the way that the original folks of Nao did. So, they would argue against that and would be just as reasonable in doing so. This is why the partial merge was a big mistake; it should have been a full merge or none at all. This situation is neither the fault of Naowegians or Alexinans.
    Crimsọn wrote: »
    Crimsọn wrote: »
    Well I sure as hell am not giving up my name. I wanted this name for over a decade. If we go through another merge I'm gonna have to schedule two days off like I did before in order to get this name. In a way Crimson costed me two days of pay. I won't give it up.

    Yeah, those on Nao already shouldn't have to go through the name change process again. If they need it, buy it.

    And we can't have duplicate names with unique serials because reputations would be put at risk from trollers. Basically we can't have a dozen Crimsons running around. :D

    No, with unlimited names that would not be the case. In the real world if we meet someone and want to speak to them in the future we exchange numbers; it would be the same in-game. We would be differentiated by these numbers. Say, hold down the alt key and where your name displays is replaced by, lets call it, your "fone number" instead. If I want to send a note to a particular Crimson I would send it to the correct fone number. People selling stuff would say things like "NM FN 987654321". In Dunby Square, the chat log would show:
    Crimson   987654321: Heya Greta nice skateboard, where'd you get it?
    Gretux    123456789: I got lucky, I found it in a personal shop on Ch 2 for 300k! XD
    Kenkosama 000000666: Bitchen!  Good colour too!
    Helsa0151 000000000: Damn! I didn't think I could do better than 300k; pooper doopers! DX
    
    KensamaofmariNegumikoSherri
  • CrimsọnCrimsọn
    Mabinogi Rep: 65,165
    Posts: 9,159
    Member
    Yeah I get you, like how discord does it. It would require substantial coding, coding of which might break a whole bunch of bleep in-game. Something that they just can't put a new skin over or apply a new animation. Yeah not happening. 9dnGeIh.png
    KensamaofmariHelsa
  • HelsaHelsa
    Mabinogi Rep: 23,380
    Posts: 5,764
    Member
    Crimsọn wrote: »
    Yeah I get you, like how discord does it. It would require substantial coding, coding of which might break a whole bunch of bleep in-game. Something that they just can't put a new skin over or apply a new animation. Yeah not happening. 9dnGeIh.png

    If they leave it to the last minute there will be more problems, of course, but that's the case for anything. Since Alexina is "healthy enough", at the moment, they have the time to QA the heck out of it internally and maybe even leave it to only one person to work on, for now, rather than the whole team in a panic at the last minute.
  • CrimsọnCrimsọn
    Mabinogi Rep: 65,165
    Posts: 9,159
    Member
    Helsa wrote: »
    Crimsọn wrote: »
    Yeah I get you, like how discord does it. It would require substantial coding, coding of which might break a whole bunch of bleep in-game. Something that they just can't put a new skin over or apply a new animation. Yeah not happening. 9dnGeIh.png

    If they leave it to the last minute there will be more problems, of course, but that's the case for anything. Since Alexina is "healthy enough", at the moment, they have the time to QA the heck out of it internally and maybe even leave it to only one person to work on, for now, rather than the whole team in a panic at the last minute.

    Yeah I don't believe that bleep either.
    I mean we STILL have +server characters out there. 9dnGeIh.png
    Helsa
  • HelsaHelsa
    Mabinogi Rep: 23,380
    Posts: 5,764
    Member
    Crimsọn wrote: »
    Helsa wrote: »
    Crimsọn wrote: »
    Yeah I get you, like how discord does it. It would require substantial coding, coding of which might break a whole bunch of bleep in-game. Something that they just can't put a new skin over or apply a new animation. Yeah not happening. 9dnGeIh.png

    If they leave it to the last minute there will be more problems, of course, but that's the case for anything. Since Alexina is "healthy enough", at the moment, they have the time to QA the heck out of it internally and maybe even leave it to only one person to work on, for now, rather than the whole team in a panic at the last minute.

    Yeah I don't believe that bleep either.
    I mean we STILL have +server characters out there. 9dnGeIh.png

    I don't understand, what does folks on Nao still having server tags in their name have to do with whether Alexina has above critical activity? By "healthy enough" I meant that there is more activity on it right now than what the best pre-merge member of Nao had. It is noticeably less than it was before the merge but still above the critical levels of the other servers, Since Nexon was adverse to a merge until 2019, this attitude, with the fact that the 2019 partial-merge created a mess, with the fact that the present activity numbers of Alexina, give them the excuse to not act, for now, means that they now have the time to figure a way out of the corner they've painted themself into, which they must, given the fact that a full merge is one day inevitable.
    Negumiko
  • VimaVima
    Mabinogi Rep: 925
    Posts: 68
    Member
    Are we not going to talk about how scary this actually is? Or is it simply because we aren't allowed to?
  • VimaVima
    Mabinogi Rep: 925
    Posts: 68
    Member
    I don't find this funny, as they've been nonsensically littering desks in the form of genitalia across some channels
    Crimsọn
  • HelsaHelsa
    Mabinogi Rep: 23,380
    Posts: 5,764
    Member
    edited September 18, 2020
    Vima wrote: »
    I don't find this funny, as they've been nonsensically littering desks in the form of genitalia across some channels

    Welcome to internet: a place where teenage boys, and older ones that have yet to grow up, have ready access.
    KensamaofmariWolfsingerCrimsọnSherri
  • WolfsingerWolfsinger
    Mabinogi Rep: 5,875
    Posts: 1,372
    Member
    Vima wrote: »
    I don't find this funny, as they've been nonsensically littering desks in the form of genitalia across some channels

    I feel lucky then, the most I've seen is them clumped around Suya like chicks around a mama hen trying to get warm-
  • CrimsọnCrimsọn
    Mabinogi Rep: 65,165
    Posts: 9,159
    Member
    edited September 18, 2020
    Vima wrote: »
    Are we not going to talk about how scary this actually is? Or is it simply because we aren't allowed to?
    Vima wrote: »
    I don't find this funny, as they've been nonsensically littering desks in the form of genitalia across some channels

    It's not THAT scary. Black robing is scary. This...this is just a griefer. I honestly find it amusing. :D

    Anyway, it will be over once the event is over. They did the same thing when we had the pottery event. For some reason there is a dupe exploit available that allows this madness. Either way there doesn't seem to be anything they can do except ban the perps. They -attempted- to stop them with the last maintenance - but updates are usually available soon after to nullify their attempts.

    It's almost like they knew this was going to happen with this event and tried to prevent it. :trollface:

    A- for effort.
    Helsa