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Elves Being Better at Magic

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  • SirRyuSirRyu
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    edited March 13, 2017
    Cassafras wrote: »
    Elves come from the desert, they don't need a forest themed summon. Don't get all Mabinogi duel on me.
    Crisis1 wrote: »
    elves live in the desert.

    Only because of the curse of Irinid. Filia was originally a lush magical forest like the Shyllien Nature Reserve. Elves being especially good at magic and having access to long-lost mystical powers of nature makes perfect sense.

    Apparently it was actually a prairie not a forest.
  • CassafrasCassafras
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    From the wiki
    Connous was once a lush forest and a large green prairie, but some major event [The Curse of Irinid] in the past changed it into a barren sand dune desert forever.

    And in conversations with various NPCs throughout Iria and the storyline, it is revealed that the Shyllien Nature Reserve is like what Filia used to be. Magical forest, thick enough with magic that Shyllien forms.
  • SirRyuSirRyu
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    Cassafras wrote: »
    From the wiki
    Connous was once a lush forest and a large green prairie, but some major event [The Curse of Irinid] in the past changed it into a barren sand dune desert forever.

    And in conversations with various NPCs throughout Iria and the storyline, it is revealed that the Shyllien Nature Reserve is like what Filia used to be. Magical forest, thick enough with magic that Shyllien forms.

    "Unfortunately, the Giants and Elves suffered from greed and wanted to control, and tried to gain a hold of the Heart of Courcle. She felt remorse as she had regretted all her work for Iria, then was soon angered and had put a "curse" on all of Iria: she destroyed all the ancient relics, changed Connous from a green prairie into a barren desert which caused the Elves to suffer from heat and a doomed transformation"

    Think the elves mighta lived in the prairie but Connous had a forest as well? If the place is like the reserve it seems more like a prairie than a forest since it lacks trees and such.
  • ApollodorusApollodorus
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    Cassafras wrote: »
    Elves come from the desert, they don't need a forest themed summon. Don't get all Mabinogi duel on me.
    Crisis1 wrote: »
    elves live in the desert.



    Only because of the curse of Irinid. Filia was originally a lush magical forest like the Shyllien Nature Reserve; most of the entire region of Connous was either thick forest or picturesque green prairie. The NPC Dr. Lambert theorizes that the Shyllien Nature Reserve even appearing again was a direct result of the curse of Irinid being broken. The ancient Elves lived in a forest thick with magic and used Shyllien, a powerful, unstable magical resource to great effect. Elves being especially good at magic and having access to long-lost mystical powers of nature makes perfect sense, it's the entire history of their people. It certainly makes a lot more sense than "they can shoot bows better".

    I wouldn't call Shyllien a forest...by like any stretch. It is mostly shrubbery and mutated flowers, and very few trees. I agree with SirRyu on this one, closer to a prairie than a forest. Giants on the other hand have Silva Forest, so if anything they should get the Ent. Elves can get a prairie dog or an Ifrit or something.
  • AeolysAeolys
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    I think the elves' "dual" ability is their ranged attack; it attacks two times (yes it sucks since it doesn't make their other ranged skills hit two times). I have a lot of doubt that elves will get a unique dual weapon since we got this.
  • CassafrasCassafras
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    The Shyllien Nature Reserve is a young forest, one that has only recently begun growing again. Of course there are no giant, mature trees yet, in the context of the game it hasn't been around long enough for them to grow to adulthood. Saplings, Shrubs and other plants dominate the landscape of a young forest. When it matures (if the devs ever decide to implement an update like that), there will be fully grown trees. Shyllien and Filia were both forested areas before the Curse of Irinid turned them to desert, that's explicitly stated by certain NPCs, and if I can find the dialogue again I'll post screenshots of it.

    In mythology and folklore; and additionally in almost every high fantasy work, ever, Elves are race who were born from and deeply connected to the forest. There's no reason Mabinogi, which tries to adhere to Irish mythology, would be any different.
  • SirRyuSirRyu
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    edited March 13, 2017
    Cassafras wrote: »
    The Shyllien Nature Reserve is a young forest, one that has only recently begun growing again. Of course there are no giant, mature trees yet, in the context of the game it hasn't been around long enough for them to grow to adulthood. Saplings, Shrubs and other plants dominate the landscape of a young forest. When it matures (if the devs ever decide to implement an update like that), there will be fully grown trees. Shyllien and Filia were both forested areas before the Curse of Irinid turned them to desert, that's explicitly stated by certain NPCs, and if I can find the dialogue again I'll post screenshots of it.

    In mythology and folklore; and additionally in almost every high fantasy work, ever, Elves are race who were born from and deeply connected to the forest. There's no reason Mabinogi, which tries to adhere to Irish mythology, would be any different.

    The stray plants you see around Shyllien look more like the grass commonly found among prairies rather than tree saplings, and there are many different type of elves in fiction rather than your run of the mill forest elf.

    800px-Midewin1.JPG

    Here's an example of the type of plants that are commonly found among a prairie.
  • AlmostNotsuperAlmostNotsuper
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    Aeolys wrote: »
    I think the elves' "dual" ability is their ranged attack; it attacks two times (yes it sucks since it doesn't make their other ranged skills hit two times). I have a lot of doubt that elves will get a unique dual weapon since we got this.

    Agreed here, though I don't think it sucks. Dual swords don't smash or windmill twice. However, if the supposed elf lag bothers you, it might be more trouble than it's worth. Maybe we should just give elves a buffed version of human ranged attack if it can't be fixed. I don't think that would actually improve elves much, but it would stop some of the QQing, although, most of the QQing I've seen in recent threads seems to be more to do with stats (somewhat reasonable because hybrid talents) and the lack of an FH-class skill (just elves wishing they had a race-exclusive, lazy way to nuke everything too, or at least that humans didn't have one; I'm certain most would prefer the former, though). Elves seem to have largely given up on archery, at least on the forums. A lot of the elves I've seen spamming conflict have been archers. That vocal minority thing at work again, I guess.

    Besides, I can't think of any magic weapon that wouldn't look weird dual-wielded, except for the book idea someone mentioned.

    ...This ended up being a bit more rant-y than I initially thought it would be
  • ElfvieElfvie
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    edited March 13, 2017
    Okay first time posting so dramatic...

    ABOUT elf magic "gimpness". I have thought up an idea. It'll sound crazy at first, but it'll make sense if I explain the balance to you. You know that 400% aim boost that you can use once in game day, and duration based off of total level? (Accumulated level) How about same thing for mage, (What? 4x faster magic?) no I mean cc+4. (Chain Casting) WOAH OP NERF NERF... Listen... cc+4, what would that affect? Most skills in fact, and I'm saying this for adv magic included. That would include Hailstorm, fireball, thunder, icespear, ice bolt, ect. Woah too overpowered? Let me explain some skills.

    Hailstorm, the heavy damage dealer, uses magic attack as a multiplier( I think I read that in wiki). This would be the elf mage's WEAKER equivalent to magnum spam with Final shot. How? Hailstorm with full charges CAN hit as strong as magnum. Yes. But weaker. Also another thing, the knockback on hailstorm, if you get knocked back you have to load up hailstorm again, like what 2-5 seconds? Hailstorm would be the magnum spam verison of elf mage. (with cc+4 duration based off total level, and only once per day in game)

    What about Firebolt?
    You have cc wands.
    Icebolt?
    It's small damage, and you have that tribolt sitting in ur inventory so it'd do nothing if you use tribolt.
    Lightning bolt?
    Same story as above

    Ice spear????
    It's very slow, and why would you spam ice spear?

    Fireball? This sounds op.
    Did you not hear about giants getting almost AOE equivalent to bash? I'm talking about Windguard -> Giant full swing. Why shouldn't elves get some skill that allow some good aoe clear, Also do know that giants can use windguard based of reforges and cooldown is relatively low. Elves would only get cc+4 from ONCE in DAY (game) or snap cast.

    Thunder?
    Loading time, attack delay, and it's same story with fireball.

    Other skills? Doesn't affect them too much.


    Balance wise, I think it balances well... tell me if I'm wrong. I'm not a game developer or anything.

    Lore wise:
    Mores cc, gods and goddesses cc... I'm confused as to why plants can cc out of their butt anytime they want, but if Elves study these plants, and ALOT, couldn't they, Idk learn from them?

    TunfiskSherri
  • NeynaNeyna
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    edited March 13, 2017
    Elfvie wrote: »
    I'm confused as to why plants can cc out of their butt anytime they want, but if Elves study these plants, and ALOT, couldn't they, Idk learn from them?

    ded

    Kinda reminds me of those NPC/Mobs being able to "Drop Kick" without pulling a combo in Grandmaster Missions too..

    Mage would be op af if you can chain cast fireball constantly. But hailstorm should at least get a chain casting (even with snap cast).. I don't see a reason why not..

    Now if only the devs read this thread and get some hints/ideas about elves wanting mage buffs for elves too.. not only archery related.
    TunfiskSherri
  • ElfvieElfvie
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    edited March 13, 2017
    Neyna wrote: »
    Elfvie wrote: »
    I'm confused as to why plants can cc out of their butt anytime they want, but if Elves study these plants, and ALOT, couldn't they, Idk learn from them?

    ded

    Kinda reminds me of those NPC/Mobs being able to "Drop Kick" without pulling a combo in Grandmaster Missions too..

    Mage would be op af if you can chain cast fireball constantly. But hailstorm should at least get a chain casting (even with snap cast).. I don't see a reason why not..

    Now if only the devs read this thread and get some hints/ideas about elves wanting mage buffs for elves too.. not only archery related.
    Regarding fireball,

    I can tell you 2 skills that are similar, Aoe bash Giant Full Swing and Crash shot. I explained GFS but i had an idea about crash shot equlivant. That 400% aim boost will also affect crash shot for elves. If they could make use of the ttl/ duration equation. At my current time if the update would come now i'd be able to use 2min 30 seconds of it. Same story if my idea would come. 2min 30 seconds of fireball. Maybe nexon finds this too op? Crash shot needs reforges for it to have distance and fragments right? How about: Reforge: Unlocks Fireball (Or ADV magic skills) for cc use during Elfvie's elf magic yummy time (TM) that is on clothing/or wig either one or both? Yes if someone hit high enough total level to have infinte usage of this they could cc fireball whenever they want. But you could have 400% aim speed when ever you want also. Balance is fun to look at. <3

    Besides if ur ttl 80k or something... I think you deserve it... plus a cookie.
  • KagaKaga
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    edited March 13, 2017
    Lmao here we are at "lores" again.

    I agree with @neyna and @elfvie, if anything fighter needs a revamp but that's another story.

    Like I said earlier; if DevCat ever chooses to give elves some kind of magic revamp/buff, it will definitely not just be because of the lore.

    I also hope they would take a few of the ideas that have been discussed here.

    Oh also about dual arrows; they suck. Even a single bash is better.
  • SirRyuSirRyu
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    Kaga wrote: »
    Lmao here we are at "lores" again.

    I agree with @neyna and @elfvie, if anything fighter needs a revamp but that's another story.

    Like I said earlier; if DevCat ever chooses to give elves some kind of magic revamp/buff, it will definitely not just be because of the lore.

    I also hope they would take a few of the ideas that have been discussed here.

    Oh also about dual arrows; they suck. Even a single bash is better.

    But kaga~ your whole argument about elves being good at magic comes from lore.
  • KagaKaga
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    SirRyu wrote: »
    Kaga wrote: »
    Lmao here we are at "lores" again.

    I agree with @neyna and @elfvie, if anything fighter needs a revamp but that's another story.

    Like I said earlier; if DevCat ever chooses to give elves some kind of magic revamp/buff, it will definitely not just be because of the lore.

    I also hope they would take a few of the ideas that have been discussed here.

    Oh also about dual arrows; they suck. Even a single bash is better.

    But kaga~ your whole argument about elves being good at magic comes from lore.

    Okay, sure it comes from MABINOGI's lore, but I don't sit here and nitpick every detail about the lore; Infact I didn't even mention the lore on my FIRST comment.

    I simply suggested what elves should get, if they ever get a magic buff, it will be most likely because people complained.
    DevCat ain't gonna care about your "tolkien" lore or whatever.
  • SirRyuSirRyu
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    Kaga wrote: »
    SirRyu wrote: »
    Kaga wrote: »
    Lmao here we are at "lores" again.

    I agree with @neyna and @elfvie, if anything fighter needs a revamp but that's another story.

    Like I said earlier; if DevCat ever chooses to give elves some kind of magic revamp/buff, it will definitely not just be because of the lore.

    I also hope they would take a few of the ideas that have been discussed here.

    Oh also about dual arrows; they suck. Even a single bash is better.

    But kaga~ your whole argument about elves being good at magic comes from lore.

    Okay, sure it comes from MABINOGI's lore, but I don't sit here and nitpick every detail about the lore; Infact I didn't even mention the lore on my FIRST comment.

    I simply suggested what elves should get, if they ever get a magic buff, it will be most likely because people complained.
    DevCat ain't gonna care about your "tolkien" lore or whatever.

    Your first post was made about a magic buff for elves. It's probably a safe bet that you got the idea from the lore, no?
  • KagaKaga
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    edited March 14, 2017
    SirRyu wrote: »
    Kaga wrote: »
    SirRyu wrote: »
    Kaga wrote: »
    Lmao here we are at "lores" again.

    I agree with @neyna and @elfvie, if anything fighter needs a revamp but that's another story.

    Like I said earlier; if DevCat ever chooses to give elves some kind of magic revamp/buff, it will definitely not just be because of the lore.

    I also hope they would take a few of the ideas that have been discussed here.

    Oh also about dual arrows; they suck. Even a single bash is better.

    But kaga~ your whole argument about elves being good at magic comes from lore.

    Okay, sure it comes from MABINOGI's lore, but I don't sit here and nitpick every detail about the lore; Infact I didn't even mention the lore on my FIRST comment.

    I simply suggested what elves should get, if they ever get a magic buff, it will be most likely because people complained.
    DevCat ain't gonna care about your "tolkien" lore or whatever.

    Your first post was made about a magic buff for elves. It's probably a safe bet that you got the idea from the lore, no?

    Nah, I simply replied to the thread title, should be obvious, no?

    On top of that, I get it from elves getting more int than humans, same with dex. Now what does that mean? they are supposed to be better in those 2 fields.
    Neyna
  • ApollodorusApollodorus
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    Elfvie wrote: »
    Neyna wrote: »
    Elfvie wrote: »
    I'm confused as to why plants can cc out of their butt anytime they want, but if Elves study these plants, and ALOT, couldn't they, Idk learn from them?

    ded

    Kinda reminds me of those NPC/Mobs being able to "Drop Kick" without pulling a combo in Grandmaster Missions too..

    Mage would be op af if you can chain cast fireball constantly. But hailstorm should at least get a chain casting (even with snap cast).. I don't see a reason why not..

    Now if only the devs read this thread and get some hints/ideas about elves wanting mage buffs for elves too.. not only archery related.
    Regarding fireball,

    I can tell you 2 skills that are similar, Aoe bash Giant Full Swing and Crash shot. I explained GFS but i had an idea about crash shot equlivant. That 400% aim boost will also affect crash shot for elves. If they could make use of the ttl/ duration equation. At my current time if the update would come now i'd be able to use 2min 30 seconds of it. Same story if my idea would come. 2min 30 seconds of fireball. Maybe nexon finds this too op? Crash shot needs reforges for it to have distance and fragments right? How about: Reforge: Unlocks Fireball (Or ADV magic skills) for cc use during Elfvie's elf magic yummy time (TM) that is on clothing/or wig either one or both? Yes if someone hit high enough total level to have infinte usage of this they could cc fireball whenever they want. But you could have 400% aim speed when ever you want also. Balance is fun to look at. <3

    Besides if ur ttl 80k or something... I think you deserve it... plus a cookie.

    Only thing I could think about all day was that if you got snapcast fireball x8 sufficiently leveled elves shadow wiz runs would be over in like a minute. Would be fun though, might actually bother making a staff for my elf if they did that. Oh, and crashshot is a bad comparison because (aside from lackluster damage) it has a cool down.
  • SirRyuSirRyu
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    Kaga wrote: »
    SirRyu wrote: »
    Kaga wrote: »
    SirRyu wrote: »
    Kaga wrote: »
    Lmao here we are at "lores" again.

    I agree with @neyna and @elfvie, if anything fighter needs a revamp but that's another story.

    Like I said earlier; if DevCat ever chooses to give elves some kind of magic revamp/buff, it will definitely not just be because of the lore.

    I also hope they would take a few of the ideas that have been discussed here.

    Oh also about dual arrows; they suck. Even a single bash is better.

    But kaga~ your whole argument about elves being good at magic comes from lore.

    Okay, sure it comes from MABINOGI's lore, but I don't sit here and nitpick every detail about the lore; Infact I didn't even mention the lore on my FIRST comment.

    I simply suggested what elves should get, if they ever get a magic buff, it will be most likely because people complained.
    DevCat ain't gonna care about your "tolkien" lore or whatever.

    Your first post was made about a magic buff for elves. It's probably a safe bet that you got the idea from the lore, no?

    Nah, I simply replied to the thread title, should be obvious, no?

    On top of that, I get it from elves getting more int than humans, same with dex. Now what does that mean? they are supposed to be better in those 2 fields.

    So when you picked elf as a character you didn't let the lore influence your choice in anyway? (such as them having an advantage in magic and archery) Which they do have via stat growth in that part as well as a few perks that didn't age that well but were pretty significant way back when.
  • KagaKaga
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    edited March 14, 2017
    SirRyu wrote: »
    Kaga wrote: »
    SirRyu wrote: »
    Kaga wrote: »
    SirRyu wrote: »
    Kaga wrote: »
    Lmao here we are at "lores" again.

    I agree with @neyna and @elfvie, if anything fighter needs a revamp but that's another story.

    Like I said earlier; if DevCat ever chooses to give elves some kind of magic revamp/buff, it will definitely not just be because of the lore.

    I also hope they would take a few of the ideas that have been discussed here.

    Oh also about dual arrows; they suck. Even a single bash is better.

    But kaga~ your whole argument about elves being good at magic comes from lore.

    Okay, sure it comes from MABINOGI's lore, but I don't sit here and nitpick every detail about the lore; Infact I didn't even mention the lore on my FIRST comment.

    I simply suggested what elves should get, if they ever get a magic buff, it will be most likely because people complained.
    DevCat ain't gonna care about your "tolkien" lore or whatever.

    Your first post was made about a magic buff for elves. It's probably a safe bet that you got the idea from the lore, no?

    Nah, I simply replied to the thread title, should be obvious, no?

    On top of that, I get it from elves getting more int than humans, same with dex. Now what does that mean? they are supposed to be better in those 2 fields.

    So when you picked elf as a character you didn't let the lore influence your choice in anyway? (such as them having an advantage in magic and archery) Which they do have via stat growth in that part as well as a few perks that didn't age that well but were pretty significant way back when.

    Nope. Nor did I think about disadvantages and advantages (that was years ago)
    I simply picked elves because they looked cool.
    But now since I played the game for a while (know more advantages and disadvantages between the 3 races) and I am a capped elf, I realized what elves lack compared to the other races.
  • SirRyuSirRyu
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    edited March 14, 2017
    Kaga wrote: »

    Nope. Nor did I think about disadvantages and advantages (that was years ago)
    I simply picked elves because they looked cool.
    But now since I played the game for a while (know more advantages and disadvantages between the 3 races) and I am a capped elf, I realized what elves lack compared to the other races.

    Apparently from the way updates are going seems like they want to keep magic neutral between the races and archery as the main focus of elves. While this might be disappointing to some it's just like every other race, each one has an ace up their sleeve that'll let them toss out tons of damage (or at least they will after these updates) If you decide not to use them that's your choice, it doesn't make the update bad or the skill any less powerful.