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Dark skinned elves?

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  • AeolysAeolys
    Mabinogi Rep: 5,115
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    edited May 19, 2017
    Original Treasure Hunter artwork anyone? Before becoming a boring human male.

    Treasure_Hunter_Female.jpg

    Edit: Crap, I didn't notice this image was already mentioned in the second page. It totally didn't load for me.
    ZeoWolfandWolfHumiliating
  • WolfandWolfWolfandWolf
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    Posts: 786
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    edited May 19, 2017
    Xiokun wrote: »
    Drow elves! @WolfandWolf

    b85d46af19fb16778271091af263f5b5.jpg

    dark_elf_by_njoo.jpg

    Oh ok! They look good. I've since looked it up and came up with Dungeons and Dragons, where they are some kind of separate race that are not the same as regular elves.

    EDIT: Back on topic, though, in the meantime we have to make do with only using those color crowns huh? :/ I wish you could have the skin color without the actual crown showing. :/ :/
  • OpalthiraOpalthira
    Mabinogi Rep: 7,580
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    Xiokun wrote: »
    Drow elves! @WolfandWolf


    Oh ok! They look good. I've since looked it up and came up with Dungeons and Dragons, where they are some kind of separate race that are not the same as regular elves.

    EDIT: Back on topic, though, in the meantime we have to make do with only using those color crowns huh? :/ I wish you could have the skin color without the actual crown showing. :/ :/

    Only way to do that is wear it in your normal tab and then use style tab with a hat on i think.
  • ZeoZeo
    Mabinogi Rep: 7,030
    Posts: 521
    Member
    edited May 19, 2017
    Opalthira wrote: »
    Xiokun wrote: »
    Drow elves! @WolfandWolf


    Oh ok! They look good. I've since looked it up and came up with Dungeons and Dragons, where they are some kind of separate race that are not the same as regular elves.

    EDIT: Back on topic, though, in the meantime we have to make do with only using those color crowns huh? :/ I wish you could have the skin color without the actual crown showing. :/ :/

    Only way to do that is wear it in your normal tab and then use style tab with a hat on i think.

    This but I have to take off my pumpkin crown when I have to put on gear for running stuffs like Rabbie Phantasm or Rundal Adv HM which make my skin pale again. :( Which is one of the reasons why I want elves to be able to have the options for dark skintones.
  • BlissfulkillBlissfulkill
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    If you cannot cite the lore reason, then there probably is not any. That being said, there is not any, explicit or hinted at.

    Black Hair=/=Dark Skin.

    Where the heck do you get those confused? That being said, Black hair does exist, it just heavily discriminated against as a curse, something Milletians would not know about before they chose elves, and perhaps does not refer to Milletians at all, who were at one time elves who did not suffer adverse effects of Irinid's Curse and needed the memory tower, as well as being functionally immortal, etc etc. in a war/cold war between giants and elves that they could not risk any newcomers that would likely contribute to said cause.

    If you have no citation of where the lore states it explicitly, and you do not know much about it in the first place, then you have no authority to discuss it as if you do know.

    I am a bit mad. Cite your dang sources. Post screen shots. Do not argue for the sake of being right.
    Zeo
  • FrosslassFrosslass
    Mabinogi Rep: 820
    Posts: 25
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    If you cannot cite the lore reason, then there probably is not any. That being said, there is not any, explicit or hinted at.

    Black Hair=/=Dark Skin.

    Where the heck do you get those confused? That being said, Black hair does exist, it just heavily discriminated against as a curse, something Milletians would not know about before they chose elves, and perhaps does not refer to Milletians at all, who were at one time elves who did not suffer adverse effects of Irinid's Curse and needed the memory tower, as well as being functionally immortal, etc etc. in a war/cold war between giants and elves that they could not risk any newcomers that would likely contribute to said cause.

    If you have no citation of where the lore states it explicitly, and you do not know much about it in the first place, then you have no authority to discuss it as if you do know.

    I am a bit mad. Cite your dang sources. Post screen shots. Do not argue for the sake of being right.

    who are you telling to cite their sources? this suddenly got deeper than i think it needed to be lol
  • BlissfulkillBlissfulkill
    Mabinogi Rep: 24,290
    Posts: 2,789
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    Frosslass wrote: »
    If you cannot cite the lore reason, then there probably is not any. That being said, there is not any, explicit or hinted at.

    Black Hair=/=Dark Skin.

    Where the heck do you get those confused? That being said, Black hair does exist, it just heavily discriminated against as a curse, something Milletians would not know about before they chose elves, and perhaps does not refer to Milletians at all, who were at one time elves who did not suffer adverse effects of Irinid's Curse and needed the memory tower, as well as being functionally immortal, etc etc. in a war/cold war between giants and elves that they could not risk any newcomers that would likely contribute to said cause.

    If you have no citation of where the lore states it explicitly, and you do not know much about it in the first place, then you have no authority to discuss it as if you do know.

    I am a bit mad. Cite your dang sources. Post screen shots. Do not argue for the sake of being right.

    who are you telling to cite their sources? this suddenly got deeper than i think it needed to be lol
    Frosslass wrote: »
    If you cannot cite the lore reason, then there probably is not any. That being said, there is not any, explicit or hinted at.

    Black Hair=/=Dark Skin.

    Where the heck do you get those confused? That being said, Black hair does exist, it just heavily discriminated against as a curse, something Milletians would not know about before they chose elves, and perhaps does not refer to Milletians at all, who were at one time elves who did not suffer adverse effects of Irinid's Curse and needed the memory tower, as well as being functionally immortal, etc etc. in a war/cold war between giants and elves that they could not risk any newcomers that would likely contribute to said cause.

    If you have no citation of where the lore states it explicitly, and you do not know much about it in the first place, then you have no authority to discuss it as if you do know.

    I am a bit mad. Cite your dang sources. Post screen shots. Do not argue for the sake of being right.

    who are you telling to cite their sources? this suddenly got deeper than i think it needed to be lol

    Well now, I was reminiscing about such a thread before, when a guy with a Shirou Emiya avatar argued against this measure, for "lore" reasons, and hence my anger. My problem is that he could not cite the lore, which led me to conclude he just did not care enough to actually read it, which bothers me when people pretend to be knowledgeable over something they are not, refuse to acknowledge their lack of knowledge, for the apparent reason of being acknowledged as "right".

    It just angers me, more so when the avatar is of one the dumbest characters in Japanese media.
    Xiokun
  • halftreehalftree
    Mabinogi Rep: 200
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    edited May 21, 2017
    The darkest shade we can get is not even dark unless you stand next to sb really white. :)
    Once my daughter dresses in light colour, her tanned long legs look super sexy, prpr. <3
    I want it to be darker. Come on, we live in the desert!
  • justshowingjustshowing
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    Diversity drives customers dev you know this... YOU KNOW THIS :(
    ZeoDaktaro
  • ZeoZeo
    Mabinogi Rep: 7,030
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    edited May 21, 2017
    Well now, I was reminiscing about such a thread before, when a guy with a Shirou Emiya avatar argued against this measure, for "lore" reasons, and hence my anger. My problem is that he could not cite the lore, which led me to conclude he just did not care enough to actually read it, which bothers me when people pretend to be knowledgeable over something they are not, refuse to acknowledge their lack of knowledge, for the apparent reason of being acknowledged as "right".

    It just angers me, more so when the avatar is of one the dumbest characters in Japanese media.

    Yep I remember this back in old Nexon forums where @Blissfulkill referred this guy? My memories are not exactly clear about this but now I'm getting a guy who is pulling a similar crap on me and everyone else on my current suggestion thread where I was asking Nexon/DevCat to give us the dark skintones... he was acting like he know the Mabinogi lore without citing or showing us in-game sceenshot of where it was stated that elves cannot have the dark skintones so I had to ask him the second time and he went quiet.

    And also... to certain people who act like they know the Mabinogi lore and try to say that all elves are supposed to be fair-skinned... please just shut your mouth unless you actually know crap about Mabinogi lore and that it was never stated that elves can't have dark skintones.

    Heck, we even have three (one being event) elf NPCs who have tan/dark skintones in Mabinogi yet we elves can't have the dark skin options... :/ Why, Nexon/DevCat?!

    Elf NPC #1... from the Samhain event.
    j747iu.jpg

    Elf NPC #2... one of the lost elves in Connous.
    Lostelf04.png

    Elf NPC #3... one of the elven Cheer Squads from the jousting arena.
    282f7v8.jpg
    KagaSphyra21WolfandWolf
  • KagaKaga
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    Frosslass wrote: »
    who are you telling to cite their sources? this suddenly got deeper than i think it needed to be lol

    You obviously have to show where you are getting all the info from, else no one will believe anything you say. *common sense*
    ZeoSphyra21TheLordofNyrin
  • KodoraKodora
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    Be glad you can even have black humans, that was a localization for the NA version of the game, cause they "needed black people to not be racist"
  • ZeoZeo
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    Kodora wrote: »
    Be glad you can even have black humans, that was a localization for the NA version of the game, cause they "needed black people to not be racist"

    But there's the dark skintone options for humans and giants back in like 2011 when I played on test server for a short time during G13 in KR Mabinogi... not sure where you've heard of this.
  • BlissfulkillBlissfulkill
    Mabinogi Rep: 24,290
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    Zeo wrote: »
    Kodora wrote: »
    Be glad you can even have black humans, that was a localization for the NA version of the game, cause they "needed black people to not be racist"

    But there's the dark skintone options for humans and giants back in like 2011 when I played on test server for a short time during G13 in KR Mabinogi... not sure where you've heard of this.

    He was referring to Bebhinn and Manus, who were both apparently white skinned versus their know black skinned counterparts. I felt this was unnecessary as no one really cared, especially with the additional of darker skinned characters like Arenen, Shamala, Cor and its residents, etc.

    That being said, the reasoning does not make sense. NPCs existed to provide services as well as have roles in the story. In essence, they are creations of the developers, strokes of creativity, while customization options existed to make the player feel like they are a major player without enforcing a completely separate character, such as how Grisaia makes it apparent that the player is NOT Yuuji, while novels like Katawa Shoujo have a faceless protaganist for self insertion.

    While blacks may not be the first to appear in an Asians mind, due to a variety of reasons, first and foremost a lack of meeting any that would remind them that they do exist, or the subtle nature of wanting an identifying character in terms of culture, it is not like they actually believe they do not exist, and the options for dark skin tones have always existed for humans, who have the greatest breadth of options (Which angers me when Elves and Giants do not even have the same basic options, and have to buy hair dyes that are available as pon colors for humans). A great deal of this is covering bases, and an a graphical change is not that hard, especially to grant convenience to players, who are already faceless enough to lack dialogue, and it is easier to insert yourself if you have total control over the character, I imagine.

    To reiterate, we often fail to see ourselves as others see us, well at least me. I don't recognize that person in the mirror, but my virtual avatar is something I can see as myself, despite the severe alterations.
    Sphyra21ZeoRadiant Dawn
  • TotonoTotono
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    I agree with the dark skin thing, but what elves need more is a seperate customization tab for elf ears. Why are faces locked to one ear style! I want tiny ears at the same time as freckles and blush and stuff! :s
    DaktaroZeoRadiant DawnRaishiivioletkittTheLordofNyrinKaiwyth
  • CrimsọnCrimsọn
    Mabinogi Rep: 64,205
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    Xiokun wrote: »
    Drow elves! @WolfandWolf

    b85d46af19fb16778271091af263f5b5.jpg

    dark_elf_by_njoo.jpg

    Oh ok! They look good. I've since looked it up and came up with Dungeons and Dragons, where they are some kind of separate race that are not the same as regular elves.

    EDIT: Back on topic, though, in the meantime we have to make do with only using those color crowns huh? :/ I wish you could have the skin color without the actual crown showing. :/ :/

    This whole game basically has a lot of aspects from D&D.
    WolfandWolf
  • TheDumbOneTheDumbOne
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    Harukari wrote: »
    Sadly there is no dark skin tones for elves. People have been begging though.. But that gets us nowhere it seems.

    begging in general, or requesting any advice.... literally anything gets use practically no were...
    Dcat682 wrote: »
    Makes sense.
    I wonder if the reason they're none are because Nexon originally wanted the characters to be seperated by race for emersion. Though geographically elves should be the darker skinned race because they are from a harsher desert like environment.
    You know... I think I'm overthinking this now.

    Edit: Oops, just realized how racist that sounded. Without expanding on my topic xD

    the reason i heard was the older quests for elves story line was there are or were explanation regarding that dark skinned elves were booted out of filia. - and thats why their isnt any. the issue is. that in its self pretty racey -
    to be honest even if the arc said "we kicked all the black elves out" would anyone really post constantly everywhere in the forums "remove black elves over story arc context" as much as people ask to add it? no

    But lets be honest do elves really have anything that makes them even at all a good race?
    we cant even even use archery on most new pets anymore, and that was one of our race abilities.
    we even got a new skill that gives us 100% with a 30minute waiting time... compare to 100% accuracy urgent shot, that only takes like 3 seconds to re-fire....
    not to mention our final shot is nothing compared to.... even just basic walking....
    Greta
  • RaishiiRaishii
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    Totono wrote: »
    I agree with the dark skin thing, but what elves need more is a seperate customization tab for elf ears. Why are faces locked to one ear style! I want tiny ears at the same time as freckles and blush and stuff! :s

    This so much. I would love to use the new facial features, but I'd rather not have an old-school anime triangle chin...
    Tsumikki
  • TotonoTotono
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    Raishii wrote: »
    Totono wrote: »
    I agree with the dark skin thing, but what elves need more is a seperate customization tab for elf ears. Why are faces locked to one ear style! I want tiny ears at the same time as freckles and blush and stuff! :s

    This so much. I would love to use the new facial features, but I'd rather not have an old-school anime triangle chin...

    Yeah! That and my hairstyle hides the tiny elf ears so it's not weird looking with my kitty ears :c
  • WolfandWolfWolfandWolf
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    TheDumbOne wrote: »
    Harukari wrote: »
    Sadly there is no dark skin tones for elves. People have been begging though.. But that gets us nowhere it seems.

    begging in general, or requesting any advice.... literally anything gets use practically no were...
    Dcat682 wrote: »
    Makes sense.
    I wonder if the reason they're none are because Nexon originally wanted the characters to be seperated by race for emersion. Though geographically elves should be the darker skinned race because they are from a harsher desert like environment.
    You know... I think I'm overthinking this now.

    Edit: Oops, just realized how racist that sounded. Without expanding on my topic xD

    the reason i heard was the older quests for elves story line was there are or were explanation regarding that dark skinned elves were booted out of filia. - and thats why their isnt any. the issue is. that in its self pretty racey -
    to be honest even if the arc said "we kicked all the black elves out" would anyone really post constantly everywhere in the forums "remove black elves over story arc context" as much as people ask to add it? no

    But lets be honest do elves really have anything that makes them even at all a good race?
    we cant even even use archery on most new pets anymore, and that was one of our race abilities.
    we even got a new skill that gives us 100% with a 30minute waiting time... compare to 100% accuracy urgent shot, that only takes like 3 seconds to re-fire....
    not to mention our final shot is nothing compared to.... even just basic walking....

    They didn't kick dark skinned elves out, they kicked black haired elves out. Because black hair was an ill omen in their viewpoint.

    I mean, I'm pretty sure that's what they said. That's why, for the longest time, you couldn't create an elf character with black hair (until they updated one day and changed that). That's also why Yvona is sitting out being anti-social, because she has black hair. That's also I think why they mentioned Atrata was going to be killed as a child, because she had black hair, but Castanea saved her.

    In short, there is no lore based reason why dark skinned elves don't exist.
    TheDumbOneZeo