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Can we not immediately scream for nerfs?

Comments

  • OpalthiraOpalthira
    Mabinogi Rep: 7,580
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    Member
    edited July 27, 2018
    Lmao this person literally is a "dark souls level noob"

    They straight up ignore the things that work simply because it goes outside of their playstyle then complain saying they shouldn't have to use things that worked and then try to do things that don't.
    Might as well use a handicraft kit and say its too hard.

    Honestly play how you want but PURPOSELY using a weak talent for your race just because you want to doesn't mean it gonna work.

    As for blaming the game on lag.
    Untitled.png
    They have nearly twice the connection speed I do and I never lagged to the point it was stopping me from succeeding.

    Also where'd did those like 50-80 naos stones they gave for free during the past week ago?
  • fennixfoxfennixfox
    Post: 1
    Member
    Imaizumi wrote: »
    To everyone taking 900s from Tagar... I'm ttlv 20k and took 400-700s. Then I put on my rka set and a set of droseras and a kite shield and activated defense every time she jumped to me. Took 100s from there and with cloud spam it's a literal breeze beyond trying to get the pillars to fall on her.

    Not to say it's easy since 100-300 is still a lot of damage to some lower level players, but it's much more manageable at least. If you don't have anchor rush but have some decent armor lying around it should be easier hopefully!

    not averyone likes to use clouds or have pets at this point.
  • BlissfulkillBlissfulkill
    Mabinogi Rep: 24,050
    Posts: 2,762
    Member
    edited July 27, 2018
    I like every boss except Doppelganger. Doppel is just a waste of time. To compare it, it is akin to my previous Organic Chemistry teacher asking us to do a limiting reagent problem, but asks us to calculate the molar mass of this given compound from the periodic table...without informing us of needing calculators.

    It is a given that calculators are not expected, since every other chemistry type teacher has given us the molar mass off the bat. In other words, it is just me adding enough numbers of varying proportion that I cannot do it in my head, several times, on a time constraint test.

    It is not that I cannot add, but that the skill is so fundamentally rudimentary that I honestly ask "What is the point?" I knew the problem and how it must be solved, but like the worst parts of math, it is tedious work that serves no purpose in accessing abilities up to those points.

    It is just a waste of time.

    Doppelganger is essentially an overblown Festia Matryoshka with more time duration, who doesn't seem to to wound fully despite my 100~100 wound rate. It isn't that I cannot do Doppel, but it is a boring boss. I am strong enough to kill it within the time frame, certainly, but I was reading a book while spamming Chain Impale and Dorcha Snatch, with summon noises alerting me to the addition of clones.

    Now imagine weaker players looking at 10 or 20 minutes of this monotony, and ask yourself "Is this a good boss fight, or an unofficial gear check? Is it fun and engaging, or a work of mental attrition?"


    Also check out Kraken from Vindictus on how not to do a previous endgame raid.
  • NinzerkerNinzerker
    Mabinogi Rep: 1,640
    Posts: 70
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    Gaea wrote: »
    Why does this have to become a novel? D:
    Because it started as one!
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mabinogion

    Opalthira wrote: »
    Lmao this person literally is a "dark souls level noob"

    They straight up ignore the things that work simply because it goes outside of their playstyle then complain saying they shouldn't have to use things that worked and then try to do things that don't.
    Might as well use a handicraft kit and say its too hard.

    Honestly play how you want but PURPOSELY using a weak talent for your race just because you want to doesn't mean it gonna work.
    You forgot to add the tl:dr

    But let us try again, I've clearly been trying several different methods, In fact every legitimate piece of advice has been heeded. My only reasoning for using a "weak" talent is due to consistency, as in: Which deals greater damage?
    If I roll extremely well and deal 200 damage every hit, and can on average hit 1 time every 2 seconds taking into account defense feathering and windmill resetting his AI, and survive a full 30 minutes then I'm dealing around a possible 180k damage (Regular Sword Attacks)
    As opposed to I deal approximately 1200 damage for a critical magnum shot or critical chain casted firebolt, I can perform one of these attacks on average every 6 seconds but my survival time drops to a span of 3 minutes due to skill load times preventing proper defensive measures. Only accumulating 36k damage.
    If the survival time was lengthened, most likely by being able to erect a more substantial defense then the damage potential could skyrocket as well, but as things currently stand:
    If loading Firebolt at the moment defense triggers and Talvish's first attack is reduced to manageable levels, Talvish will be raising his hand for the next attack by the time the attack is fully loaded, and is being launched, offering no time to load defense, even though Wands and Shields can be equipped at the same time.
    If the "Just use ____ because that's what I used" method is not providing enough time to load defense in between nearly every attack than it's simply not going to work.

    As for blaming the game on lag.
    Untitled.png
    They have nearly twice the connection speed I do and I never lagged to the point it was stopping me from succeeding.
    4701145f1d1b037fefb71a0eb9b36ee0.png
    No, I really don't. While I PAY for 10 there's always that little fine print that states you "may" receive less than advertised speeds.
    The highest tests are sub 3.5mb/s in between hours of 4:00-6:30am and continuously drops throughout the day till it hits the 300-340kb range at 10:00pm till 3:00am, snapping back to 3.5mbp/s range after dayroll.
    Also where'd did those like 50-80 naos stones they gave for free during the past week ago?
    Maybe you received 50-80 stones, but I only received 18 Nao, and 6 Guardian stones. Of which I do still have the majority of. And I'm still amassing small amounts from the current hot-air balloon event as they randomly drop. However even if I had an infinite amount of Nao stones, the chances of completing this aren't raised, in fact reliance on Nao stones is more counterproductive, as the area I'm having trouble with is time restrictions, and Nao's sluggish pace and lack of a sense of urgency compounds the issue.
  • RiddleTricksterRiddleTrickster
    Mabinogi Rep: 1,585
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    Ninzerker wrote: »
    Gaea wrote: »
    Why does this have to become a novel? D:
    Because it started as one!
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mabinogion

    Opalthira wrote: »
    Lmao this person literally is a "dark souls level noob"

    They straight up ignore the things that work simply because it goes outside of their playstyle then complain saying they shouldn't have to use things that worked and then try to do things that don't.
    Might as well use a handicraft kit and say its too hard.

    Honestly play how you want but PURPOSELY using a weak talent for your race just because you want to doesn't mean it gonna work.
    You forgot to add the tl:dr

    But let us try again, I've clearly been trying several different methods, In fact every legitimate piece of advice has been heeded. My only reasoning for using a "weak" talent is due to consistency, as in: Which deals greater damage?
    If I roll extremely well and deal 200 damage every hit, and can on average hit 1 time every 2 seconds taking into account defense feathering and windmill resetting his AI, and survive a full 30 minutes then I'm dealing around a possible 180k damage (Regular Sword Attacks)
    As opposed to I deal approximately 1200 damage for a critical magnum shot or critical chain casted firebolt, I can perform one of these attacks on average every 6 seconds but my survival time drops to a span of 3 minutes due to skill load times preventing proper defensive measures. Only accumulating 36k damage.
    If the survival time was lengthened, most likely by being able to erect a more substantial defense then the damage potential could skyrocket as well, but as things currently stand:
    If loading Firebolt at the moment defense triggers and Talvish's first attack is reduced to manageable levels, Talvish will be raising his hand for the next attack by the time the attack is fully loaded, and is being launched, offering no time to load defense, even though Wands and Shields can be equipped at the same time.
    If the "Just use ____ because that's what I used" method is not providing enough time to load defense in between nearly every attack than it's simply not going to work.

    As for blaming the game on lag.
    Untitled.png
    They have nearly twice the connection speed I do and I never lagged to the point it was stopping me from succeeding.
    4701145f1d1b037fefb71a0eb9b36ee0.png
    No, I really don't. While I PAY for 10 there's always that little fine print that states you "may" receive less than advertised speeds.
    The highest tests are sub 3.5mb/s in between hours of 4:00-6:30am and continuously drops throughout the day till it hits the 300-340kb range at 10:00pm till 3:00am, snapping back to 3.5mbp/s range after dayroll.
    Also where'd did those like 50-80 naos stones they gave for free during the past week ago?
    Maybe you received 50-80 stones, but I only received 18 Nao, and 6 Guardian stones. Of which I do still have the majority of. And I'm still amassing small amounts from the current hot-air balloon event as they randomly drop. However even if I had an infinite amount of Nao stones, the chances of completing this aren't raised, in fact reliance on Nao stones is more counterproductive, as the area I'm having trouble with is time restrictions, and Nao's sluggish pace and lack of a sense of urgency compounds the issue.

    hmm, so you haven't completed it yet? Maybe post a screen shot of your skills so we can get a better sense of your build? Which one do you main? Basic skills such as crit, defense, combat master, etc helps add up. The mission does not have you bring Talvish down to Zero, so as long as you are doing noticeable damage albeit possibly dying a few times, you should keep going.
    And juuuust in case you didn't know, when you see his swords falling automatically, use shield of trust because you know he going to use the one hit death. I put it temporary on one so I can just boop it.
  • HellkaizerHellkaizer
    Mabinogi Rep: 11,305
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    --
    I'm with this personally. I'm 14k and blew through g21 without even realizing dopple even summoned clones. Unless you only ap train it's hard to think someone 12k is stuck on this.
  • NinzerkerNinzerker
    Mabinogi Rep: 1,640
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    hmm, so you haven't completed it yet? Maybe post a screen shot of your skills so we can get a better sense of your build?
    Here you go:
    842881ebc30a5b08e909eaa35f727990.png 62492a9190b578e379250ea364c17abc.png 1354a9f0751011655c4aeedfde5576c7.png 813e9398fd3faf925c5627c76c8fc0a4.png
    9780a044a19521e18a6493bd58a6e38b.png d714a518d7ebfa7c6b2ba69038b57e79.png f350fa4a84fed045c50ab7619dcb86ed.png 3798b61c12c16f3065e95d5575d6eeb9.png
    5f4b8c4b3f8e3511c3d04f2bef3647c6.png f0223e2aa56af1aea517ab25db5f8cd5.png 5c7c01f04acdc43723cb5a49369d1339.png 6d3ccd060f69813a21c486e43152effc.png
    3663a7e67ff730d6810499d5cad41967.png 65cdd9b93d5a60ec1c42c51cd86682f1.png 7dc2631da60061d4e25ccf2682092b90.png



    Hellkaizer wrote: »
    I'm with this personally. I'm 14k and blew through g21 without even realizing dopple even summoned clones. Unless you only ap train it's hard to think someone 12k is stuck on this.
    Despite my previous written corrections it seems without another illustration some people are still inflating my total level. So for the sake of clarification
    42cb5384c1a501ded4a04fee54eb0b22.png
    While I've accumulated an additional 200 in the time difficulties arose and now I'm still a bit of a ways off from 10k, let alone 12k
  • SollSoll
    Mabinogi Rep: 3,060
    Posts: 137
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    edited July 29, 2018
    @Ninzerker having your stats up would've been beneficial to understanding your build as well.

    What you need:
    -Dorcha snatch master title
    -Knowing how to use anchor rush's invulnerability frames (to avoid the scythes)
    -Battlefield overture
    -Your best chainblades
    -Any +Critical 2nd title, or anything that adds atk or DEX. don't wear heavy armor.

    Bring down Tal to 78%; to do so, tread carefully around him, watch for openings/moments where he won't attack. The best times are usually after he just used a skill, or after a scythe attack.

    Be aware that most chainblade skills lock you in place, so favor normal hits if you're not sure if Talvish will use an attack. Just keep death mark and chain burst up when you attack.

    As was said earlier in this thread, when talvish blabbers about a prophecy, use blade on him, or simply move away far enough. (Though personally i think hitting him with anything could make him stop to use it, not entirely sure on the specifics) Use shield of trust as the blades fall, not when the message gets prompted.

    Use your best chainblade, death mark + chain burst; use the skill of your choice, either chain impale or chain crush. Be mindful of talvish's movements.

    Make sure to bring balloons and other stuff you need in your inv beforehand.

    Once you have access to Nascent divinity, use it. Make sure to move the camera a bit upwards so you can see talvish at any time.
    Use spike sparingly (still gotta watch out for the instakill skill) and stack up your counter the highest you think you can manage. if you have issues to time it right, about 10-20 count should be enough for you to use Nova obliteration. Keep stacking your counter and the mission will (probably?) eventually end.

    If this isn't enough, there's plenty of info in this thread that prolly mentions stuff i've forgotten about.
  • RiddleTricksterRiddleTrickster
    Mabinogi Rep: 1,585
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    Ninzerker wrote: »
    hmm, so you haven't completed it yet? Maybe post a screen shot of your skills so we can get a better sense of your build?
    Here you go:

    It looks like you should be able to beat him from what you have. However, you may want to rank your bow mastery, the range will definitely make a difference, and as sol said do some upgrades. Spam him with mag and support ( or just mag, in which it won't hurt to rank support too ) until the bones deploy their fire line. After they do that, I would then attack him with chain at least for a bit- even if it's just one or two hits it's fine, then move away. Also don't forget your mana shield, and trans.

    There maybe Hp buff pots around somewhere as well if you can find.
    Now, if you see his health going down just don't give up and keep going.
    Soll wrote: »
    @Ninzerker Going with the skill tabs you got, i'd say that this combo would fit you:(though having your stats up would've been more beneficial to understanding your build as well)

    What you need:
    -Dorcha snatch master title
    -any 2nd title that gives you Critical rate (Preferred), music buff or max attack. If you don't have any of those, any +DEX is fine too.
    -Divine link pet, with all crusader points put into pet damage, stun resistance, regen (and revival if it's weak-ish)
    -Battlefield Overture
    -Death mark + Chain burst
    -Your strongest upgraded chains
    -Demigod + fury of light (if you are neamhain-allied; use wings of rage if you're with morrighan.)

    Strategy:
    - Have your pet aggro and attack the main doppelganger while you kill off the first batch of clones; and through the whole fight.
    -Bring back the Doppel to the center of the area after clones are out so you can access the switches faster to snuff the next rounds
    -Go all DPS, with death mark and chain burst always up. Try to go for critical hits with Battlefield overture.
    -use your paladin/beast trans only to recover some HP in an emergency if you cannot tank well; you need the titles in this.
    -When the doppel starts using shadow spirit, if you cannot hit all the switches in time and your pet gets hit, unsummon it after shadow spirit is used and link with another pet as soon as possible.

    I've done something similar and i have a lower total than you do. Keep in mind the doppel probably has some kind of damage reduction property, a bit like green kiwis, so it may look like its regenerating faster at times, but it just means you hit harder than anticipated.
    Hope this helps!
    I believe Ninzerker is just needing help with Talvish.
  • NinzerkerNinzerker
    Mabinogi Rep: 1,640
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    Soll wrote: »
    @Ninzerker having your stats up would've been beneficial to understanding your build as well.
    6fb225bd9b82dee8128a7ec6bb679391.png
    There you go, however that's also current Ninja Rebirth, not Archer or Chain Blade for the increased Dex/Luck gains
    What you need:
    -Dorcha snatch master title
    -Knowing how to use anchor rush's invulnerability frames (to avoid the scythes)
    While I never really found the extra 10% dorcha gain all that noticeable, I suppose it can't hurt to keep it topped off, but as for Anchor Rush, there's quite a bit of slowdown on my side that makes Anchor Rush extremely inconsistent at evasion. As well as nearly nearly impossible to utilise in a swift manner (After using a hotkeyed skill, or during WASD movement, or opening inventory, or switching weapon sets. Neither the touchpad on the laptop, nor the usb mouse respond to movement for around half a second. Which is kinda important when Talvish's primary attack loop is a little longer than one full second.)
    As was said earlier in this thread, when talvish blabbers about a prophecy, use blade on him, or simply move away far enough. (Though personally i think hitting him with anything could make him stop to use it, not entirely sure on the specifics) Use shield of trust as the blades fall, not when the message gets prompted.
    While some have recommended Judgement Blade to stop his Divine Skill Seal, I find it's load times abysmal when Windmill can be used instead, sure it deals less damage, but I actually have a chance of getting the attack out before his does, it can be used a second time if he decides to immediately use the sealing attack again, and doesn't prevent use of divine shield if he instead instantly resets to his own divine blade attack
    Use your best chainblade, death mark + chain burst; use the skill of your choice, either chain impale or chain crush.
    With Battlefield Overture, Death Mark and Chain Burst it doesn't really leave much time in between for actual attacks. Between the skill load times and lag between the 15 seconds applications I'd maybe get one or two hits. But I will add that Chain Impale is on the list of skills he has resistance to. Making Chain Crush the more viable one of the two.
    If this isn't enough, there's plenty of info in this thread that prolly mentions stuff i've forgotten about.
    Starting the fight off with a shocked Spear of God can help start things off with a good 6% damage, but after the first hit feels like it gives diminishing returns

    It looks like you should be able to beat him from what you have.
    So I've heard, but even now I'm still having some unavoidable handicaps that I fear are being vastly underestimated.
    However, you may want to rank your bow mastery, the range will definitely make a difference, and as sol said do some upgrades.
    That's odd, the wiki mentions nothing about bow mastery adding extra range, only extra damage.
    Unless you mean to say just keeping around 2000 distance in between us should help with survivability in which I'd agree, I can outpace his movement easily enough, but if I can hit him from beyond the range of his attacks at the same time then even better. Currently working on an extra +100 range upgrade for my bow at the moment as well as raising Mirage Missile and Urgent Shot (The aim speed buff from urgent shot is pretty good, just wish it lasted longer than the next shot only)
    Spam him with mag and support ( or just mag, in which it won't hurt to rank support too ) until the bones deploy their fire line. After they do that, I would then attack him with chain at least for a bit- even if it's just one or two hits it's fine, then move away. Also don't forget your mana shield, and trans.
    While support shot would assist in further debuffing when switching to Chain Blade, Magnum Shot is among the listed skills that he actively resists. The non-crit damage to these are comparable if not worse than a regular attacks damage, and they seem to crit at a reduced rate
    I think if I can get Mirage Missile up a bit more than I can hit 300 damage with each damage tick, which shouldn't hurt either.
    There maybe Hp buff pots around somewhere as well if you can find.
    None such luck, would have to do quite a bit of dungeon diving for one of those. Stamina Elixers the game seems to throw at me, but not Def/Prot potions or HP elixers

    Hope tonights attempt yields more favorable results.

    violetkitt
  • HellkaizerHellkaizer
    Mabinogi Rep: 11,305
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    Ninzerker wrote: »
    None such luck, would have to do quite a bit of dungeon diving for one of those. Stamina Elixers the game seems to throw at me, but not Def/Prot potions or HP elixers

    Hope tonights attempt yields more favorable results.

    Well, Good luck but I feel like part of your issue is the computer itself.

    I had pretty bad lag when I did it as well *bootleg internet hurrah* but I also had 1800 max
  • ArbiterArbiter
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    It is too difficult. I was able to do it, since I'm a giant and I could just solo-tank the bosses, but a lot of my friends have been stuck on this generation.

    If you're level 20-40,000 and have been playing this game for years, of course ANYTHING is going to be doable or too easy for you. For average players, this generation is a vertical climb compared to other ones. I'd understand if the new boss mechanics were fun, but they aren't. Also not trying to bag on Mabinogi generally, but these bosses are entirely too difficult for some players and this isn't Dark Souls. It should not be compared to it, or anyone who gets off on insane difficulty games.
  • HellkaizerHellkaizer
    Mabinogi Rep: 11,305
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    Arbiter wrote: »
    It is too difficult. I was able to do it, since I'm a giant and I could just solo-tank the bosses, but a lot of my friends have been stuck on this generation.

    If you're level 20-40,000 and have been playing this game for years, of course ANYTHING is going to be doable or too easy for you. For average players, this generation is a vertical climb compared to other ones. I'd understand if the new boss mechanics were fun, but they aren't. Also not trying to bag on Mabinogi generally, but these bosses are entirely too difficult for some players and this isn't Dark Souls. It should not be compared to it, or anyone who gets off on insane difficulty games.

    The first boss fight in dark souls is significantly harder than any fight in g21, with novice anchor rush you can cheese like half the mechanics and ignore almost all the damage talvish does, and you can ignore ALL the damage tagar does. You can also skip the golem part with it as well.
  • ArbiterArbiter
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    Hellkaizer wrote: »
    Arbiter wrote: »
    It is too difficult. I was able to do it, since I'm a giant and I could just solo-tank the bosses, but a lot of my friends have been stuck on this generation.

    If you're level 20-40,000 and have been playing this game for years, of course ANYTHING is going to be doable or too easy for you. For average players, this generation is a vertical climb compared to other ones. I'd understand if the new boss mechanics were fun, but they aren't. Also not trying to bag on Mabinogi generally, but these bosses are entirely too difficult for some players and this isn't Dark Souls. It should not be compared to it, or anyone who gets off on insane difficulty games.

    The first boss fight in dark souls is significantly harder than any fight in g21, with novice anchor rush you can cheese like half the mechanics and ignore almost all the damage talvish does, and you can ignore ALL the damage tagar does. You can also skip the golem part with it as well.

    Mabi =/= Dark Souls. Dark Souls is also not the gold standard for game difficulty either. There is no reason that the fights in G21 part 2 should be that BS and there is also no reason that a specific skill should be required to do them in a classless game. The mechanic for the golem part is to skip it, so that's obvious.

    I know several people who cannot complete Tagar because they get double dashed and then die. There is no reason for these fights to be Nao-spamming fights for anyone not 100% intimately familiar with the game mechanics, because this IS NOT Dark Souls. I, as a Giant, can just equip a Vales Shield and take 1 damage from basically anything. End game humans can just FH. Anyone else just gets boned. That's not fair, or fun.
  • VeylaineVeylaine
    Mabinogi Rep: 3,850
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    edited August 9, 2018
    Arbiter wrote: »
    Hellkaizer wrote: »
    Arbiter wrote: »
    It is too difficult. I was able to do it, since I'm a giant and I could just solo-tank the bosses, but a lot of my friends have been stuck on this generation.

    If you're level 20-40,000 and have been playing this game for years, of course ANYTHING is going to be doable or too easy for you. For average players, this generation is a vertical climb compared to other ones. I'd understand if the new boss mechanics were fun, but they aren't. Also not trying to bag on Mabinogi generally, but these bosses are entirely too difficult for some players and this isn't Dark Souls. It should not be compared to it, or anyone who gets off on insane difficulty games.

    The first boss fight in dark souls is significantly harder than any fight in g21, with novice anchor rush you can cheese like half the mechanics and ignore almost all the damage talvish does, and you can ignore ALL the damage tagar does. You can also skip the golem part with it as well.

    Mabi =/= Dark Souls. Dark Souls is also not the gold standard for game difficulty either. There is no reason that the fights in G21 part 2 should be that BS and there is also no reason that a specific skill should be required to do them in a classless game. The mechanic for the golem part is to skip it, so that's obvious.

    I know several people who cannot complete Tagar because they get double dashed and then die. There is no reason for these fights to be Nao-spamming fights for anyone not 100% intimately familiar with the game mechanics, because this IS NOT Dark Souls. I, as a Giant, can just equip a Vales Shield and take 1 damage from basically anything. End game humans can just FH. Anyone else just gets boned. That's not fair, or fun.

    you missed the point he didn't say anything in mabi should be like dark souls, he said nothing in mabi is as hard as the first fight in dark souls unless you're just misrepresenting what he said.

    EDIT: Also idk if you can be bothered to read the entire thread (understandable since its 15 pages long), but if you take the time there are numerous people using countless different strategies to beat g21 other than nao stones.
  • dra011dra011
    Mabinogi Rep: 2,000
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    um was posti
    Hellkaizer wrote: »
    Arbiter wrote: »
    It is too difficult. I was able to do it, since I'm a giant and I could just solo-tank the bosses, but a lot of my friends have been stuck on this generation.

    If you're level 20-40,000 and have been playing this game for years, of course ANYTHING is going to be doable or too easy for you. For average players, this generation is a vertical climb compared to other ones. I'd understand if the new boss mechanics were fun, but they aren't. Also not trying to bag on Mabinogi generally, but these bosses are entirely too difficult for some players and this isn't Dark Souls. It should not be compared to it, or anyone who gets off on insane difficulty games.

    The first boss fight in dark souls is significantly harder than any fight in g21, with novice anchor rush you can cheese like half the mechanics and ignore almost all the damage talvish does, and you can ignore ALL the damage tagar does. You can also skip the golem part with it as well.

    First boss in dark souls do you mean the asylum demon? Taurus? both of those are much easier then both Tagar and Talvish as you can take a chunk of hp off both demons easy before the fight really starts with a plunge attack if you know how but with Tagar and Talvish it's not easy for most players to take off a chunk of hp off them with ease.
  • HellkaizerHellkaizer
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    dra011 wrote: »
    um was posti
    Hellkaizer wrote: »
    Arbiter wrote: »
    It is too difficult. I was able to do it, since I'm a giant and I could just solo-tank the bosses, but a lot of my friends have been stuck on this generation.

    If you're level 20-40,000 and have been playing this game for years, of course ANYTHING is going to be doable or too easy for you. For average players, this generation is a vertical climb compared to other ones. I'd understand if the new boss mechanics were fun, but they aren't. Also not trying to bag on Mabinogi generally, but these bosses are entirely too difficult for some players and this isn't Dark Souls. It should not be compared to it, or anyone who gets off on insane difficulty games.

    The first boss fight in dark souls is significantly harder than any fight in g21, with novice anchor rush you can cheese like half the mechanics and ignore almost all the damage talvish does, and you can ignore ALL the damage tagar does. You can also skip the golem part with it as well.

    First boss in dark souls do you mean the asylum demon? Taurus? both of those are much easier then both Tagar and Talvish as you can take a chunk of hp off both demons easy before the fight really starts with a plunge attack if you know how but with Tagar and Talvish it's not easy for most players to take off a chunk of hp off them with ease.

    Huh... almost like... knowing how to use anchor rush prevents you from taking damage in both of those fights almost entirely... It's game knowledge. First time I ran through souls I didn't get the plunge on tarus demon, nor did I know I could smack him off the bridge.
    Arbiter wrote: »
    I, as a Giant, can just equip a Vales Shield and take 1 damage from basically anything. End game humans can just FH. Anyone else just gets boned. That's not fair, or fun.

    As an elf I used final shot to blink away from the attacks, no one is screwed doing this unless they're ignorant and refusing to learn or just have really outdated gear.
  • YanmYanm
    Mabinogi Rep: 350
    Posts: 3
    Member
    Arbiter wrote: »
    It is too difficult. I was able to do it, since I'm a giant and I could just solo-tank the bosses, but a lot of my friends have been stuck on this generation.

    If you're level 20-40,000 and have been playing this game for years, of course ANYTHING is going to be doable or too easy for you. For average players, this generation is a vertical climb compared to other ones. I'd understand if the new boss mechanics were fun, but they aren't. Also not trying to bag on Mabinogi generally, but these bosses are entirely too difficult for some players and this isn't Dark Souls. It should not be compared to it, or anyone who gets off on insane difficulty games.

    Can we not? Dark Souls is not insanely difficult like everyone is lead to believe. You want an insanely difficult game, go play some of the old-school Nintendo Hard games.

    As far as this goes, people in the past pages have shown ways to deal with it. I think part of the problem is just that the playerbase hasn't been challenged with something hard in a long time and are used to just tanking through everything these days that isn't Alban 500% stones and/or Phantasm. This is also probably a consequence of the combat being changed in G16 and instead of their being consequences to using certain skillsets, it's all about just killing stuff as fast as possible now. I'm curious what kind of content we'd have if we never got the combat revamp, because Phantasm and Alban would not work with the old system in their current forms :C.
    Imaizumi
  • VimiVimi
    Mabinogi Rep: 2,290
    Posts: 141
    Member
    Greta wrote: »
    All you need to do is have ton of Nao/Guardian Stones and you are good to go. Potions are a bonus. Thank you events (especially Treasure Hunt one).

    This is why I like harder content. I have so many Nao Stones from events and I can't just throw them away!
    Greta
  • GTCvActiumGTCvActium
    Mabinogi Rep: 7,125
    Posts: 661
    Member
    There's also the reason that this gen was made specifically to challenge and engage veterans of 20 previous generations using mechanics and ideas brought up in all that time. Simply put its not something you can challenge if you still haven't mastered the combat in the game. Why are you guys comparing G21 to the starting fight of a Dark Souls game, the fights in this are suppose to be challenge with the knowledge of some themes and mechanics from things in the previous generations. Remember this well, this is the culmination of TWENTY generations worth of experience and fighting. This is not the tutorial level thing that G1 was. There's also the fact that not only is this the latest gen, this is the final gen for this specific chapter, it's going to kick you in the teeth.