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Mabinogi's Chair Problem

Comments

  • FluoretteFluorette
    Mabinogi Rep: 4,585
    Posts: 750
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    I have to agree with the first few responses. If this is a problem, you can hop to another channel for cleanliness. Is Ch8 somehow special to you that you can't just hop? I haven't seen any of this on the channels I typically peruse.

    On another note, if we're gonna have chairs that big, can we have a bouncy house/bouncy castle or something since we can't have the trampolines...................
    Sherri
  • CrimsọnCrimsọn
    Mabinogi Rep: 64,210
    Posts: 8,868
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    edited August 24, 2021
    Fluorette wrote: »
    I have to agree with the first few responses. If this is a problem, you can hop to another channel for cleanliness. Is Ch8 somehow special to you that you can't just hop? I haven't seen any of this on the channels I typically peruse.

    On another note, if we're gonna have chairs that big, can we have a bouncy house/bouncy castle or something since we can't have the trampolines...................

    It's a Tarlach thing.

    Cho wrote: »
    Crimsọn wrote: »
    Helsa wrote: »
    So, I decided to go check out what all the hubub was about. I found a 'boat' and I was totally able to run right through it. So, if the gates to Dunbarton were 'blocked' it was only visually. Some levels of griefing are more like the weather, I suppose.

    That's the point. It doesn't hurt anyone, it just makes idiots rage.

    It's not even angering, it's just sad. You can't have a lot of people in one place together without someone going "LOOK AT ME!" and even if there's no one there yet, they want you to look at them so badly they'll afk at or on the way to the most populated area for 24 hours hoping that someone sees them.

    Like, I'm just trying to do stardust or use the bank in Dunby but they need that validation so badly.

    Damn straight. :trollface:
    Sherri
  • BlissfulkillBlissfulkill
    Mabinogi Rep: 24,290
    Posts: 2,792
    Member
    Crimsọn wrote: »
    Helsa wrote: »
    So, I decided to go check out what all the hubub was about. I found a 'boat' and I was totally able to run right through it. So, if the gates to Dunbarton were 'blocked' it was only visually. Some levels of griefing are more like the weather, I suppose.

    That's the point. It doesn't hurt anyone, it just makes idiots rage.


    You could be more understanding you know, Crimson. Mainly because...

    B)

    Ship happens, you know?
    Crimsọn
  • NecrojokerNecrojoker
    Mabinogi Rep: 725
    Posts: 22
    Member
    Helsa wrote: »
    So, I decided to go check out what all the hubub was about. I found a 'boat' and I was totally able to run right through it. So, if the gates to Dunbarton were 'blocked' it was only visually. Some levels of griefing are more like the weather, I suppose.

    The complaint isn't so much about blocking the gate that you can easily walk through, but more so it's about blocking an NPC. Think back to any event where people cluster around an NPC and use Raincasting, Demigod, etc to try to force people to disconnect and now add giant chairs to obscure vision of the NPC. Nexon continues to give players tools to be disruptive without punishing the childish behavior. That's the complain.
  • NecrojokerNecrojoker
    Mabinogi Rep: 725
    Posts: 22
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    Fluorette wrote: »
    I have to agree with the first few responses. If this is a problem, you can hop to another channel for cleanliness. Is Ch8 somehow special to you that you can't just hop? I haven't seen any of this on the channels I typically peruse.

    On another note, if we're gonna have chairs that big, can we have a bouncy house/bouncy castle or something since we can't have the trampolines...................

    See previous statement above this one.
  • CrimsọnCrimsọn
    Mabinogi Rep: 64,210
    Posts: 8,868
    Member
    Necrojoker wrote: »
    Fluorette wrote: »
    I have to agree with the first few responses. If this is a problem, you can hop to another channel for cleanliness. Is Ch8 somehow special to you that you can't just hop? I haven't seen any of this on the channels I typically peruse.

    On another note, if we're gonna have chairs that big, can we have a bouncy house/bouncy castle or something since we can't have the trampolines...................

    See previous statement above this one.

    See previous statement above this one.
  • FluoretteFluorette
    Mabinogi Rep: 4,585
    Posts: 750
    Member
    Necrojoker wrote: »
    See previous statement above this one.

    :/ I'm not familiar with what you're describing because I typically don't touch new content until much later. That's also a way to avoid the crowds.

    Neither NX nor devCat developers are actively patrolling the game to ensure that every player is acting in line. That leaves it up to players to report others for behaviors they believe is offending
    and for a case like this I bet the Help Desk staff would just wave it off with responses that have already been provided (e.g. "we can see how this would be an annoyance to you, but you can use ALT rather than CTRL to find NPCs", "you can switch channels")

    I'm sure they anticipated this when they made a Chair item this huge. How could they not? At the same time, sure, players can expect the company to do something about it, but then the company can also expect players to make an effort to do something about it as well. That means taking what measures players CAN control to avoid common annoyances, yes? And the latter part is likely to be what they were banking on.

    Is it an annoyance? Sure, yes, of course. But you can take measures to keep your fantasy life rolling. Report, change channels, press ALT to find Melwyn, etc.
  • CrimsọnCrimsọn
    Mabinogi Rep: 64,210
    Posts: 8,868
    Member
    edited August 24, 2021
    Fluorette wrote: »
    Necrojoker wrote: »
    See previous statement above this one.

    :/ I'm not familiar with what you're describing because I typically don't touch new content until much later. That's also a way to avoid the crowds.

    Neither NX nor devCat developers are actively patrolling the game to ensure that every player is acting in line. That leaves it up to players to report others for behaviors they believe is offending
    and for a case like this I bet the Help Desk staff would just wave it off with responses that have already been provided (e.g. "we can see how this would be an annoyance to you, but you can use ALT rather than CTRL to find NPCs", "you can switch channels")

    I'm sure they anticipated this when they made a Chair item this huge. How could they not? At the same time, sure, players can expect the company to do something about it, but then the company can also expect players to make an effort to do something about it as well. That means taking what measures players CAN control to avoid common annoyances, yes? And the latter part is likely to be what they were banking on.

    Is it an annoyance? Sure, yes, of course. But you can take measures to keep your fantasy life rolling. Report, change channels, press ALT to find Melwyn, etc
    .

    Look, NA is not going to do anything about this. They knew these items were going to be obstructive. They made the choice to release this item over here so they can't punish people for using something that they released to us INTENTIONALLY. I understand getting beamed for exploiting something unintentional but THEY put these into the game. THEY made that ultimate decision when they could of easily not released it to this region. THEY knew full well of what would happen. But THEY did it anyway.

    I even said a while ago before we got these that this is a BAD idea lol. In fact imo I think they totally did it on purpose. You are being trolled by NA and they are more than likely having a little lol over this.

    You know NA had to test this content before implementing it? Think about that. :D

    Crimsọn wrote: »
    Helsa wrote: »
    So, I decided to go check out what all the hubub was about. I found a 'boat' and I was totally able to run right through it. So, if the gates to Dunbarton were 'blocked' it was only visually. Some levels of griefing are more like the weather, I suppose.

    That's the point. It doesn't hurt anyone, it just makes idiots rage.

    You could be more understanding you know, Crimson. Mainly because...

    B)

    Ship happens, you know?

    IHQ7zZY.png
    :smirk:
  • GretaGreta
    Mabinogi Rep: 51,765
    Posts: 6,975
    Member
    edited August 25, 2021
    Can't change channels or location, refuse to ignore it, probably just jealous or something (maybe a bad day?), won't admit that ALT button search does wonders and straight up thinks that such chair shouldn't exist, without agreeing that they look pretty darn cool and amusing in every way. In the end, they just feed the trolls.
    -People like OP in nutshell.
    Helsa
  • CrimsọnCrimsọn
    Mabinogi Rep: 64,210
    Posts: 8,868
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    Greta wrote: »
    Can't change channels or location, refuse to ignore it, probably just jealous or something (maybe a bad day?), won't admit that ALT button search does wonders and straight up thinks that such chair shouldn't exist, without agreeing that they look pretty darn cool and amusing in every way. In the end, they just feed the trolls.
    -People like OP in nutshell.

    Feed me more.
  • NemesisNemesis
    Mabinogi Rep: 1,805
    Posts: 96
    Member
    I know what I'm doing today
    SherriGreta
  • CrimsọnCrimsọn
    Mabinogi Rep: 64,210
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    edited August 25, 2021
    Nemesis wrote: »
    I know what I'm doing today

    Lets do it together. :trollface:

    ...as soon as maintenance is done. :|
  • SherriSherri
    Mabinogi Rep: 18,360
    Posts: 2,746
    Member
    oh man this is giving me maplestory flashbacks.. and im all for it :D i hope they make some giant pirate ship chairs next!!
  • CrimsọnCrimsọn
    Mabinogi Rep: 64,210
    Posts: 8,868
    Member
    Sherri wrote: »
    oh man this is giving me maplestory flashbacks.. and im all for it :D i hope they make some giant pirate ship chairs next!!

    I want this:
    17c1ca2ad2aecc6c3584c45c555b780f.jpg
  • NecrojokerNecrojoker
    Mabinogi Rep: 725
    Posts: 22
    Member
    edited August 25, 2021
    Crimsọn wrote: »
    Look, NA is not going to do anything about this. They knew these items were going to be obstructive. They made the choice to release this item over here so they can't punish people for using something that they released to us INTENTIONALLY. I understand getting beamed for exploiting something unintentional but THEY put these into the game. THEY made that ultimate decision when they could of easily not released it to this region. THEY knew full well of what would happen. But THEY did it anyway.

    I even said a while ago before we got these that this is a BAD idea lol. In fact imo I think they totally did it on purpose. You are being trolled by NA and they are more than likely having a little lol over this.

    You know NA had to test this content before implementing it? Think about that. .

    So you're finally understanding the point of my original post? Slow on the uptake, but at least you got there. As an aside though, the fact that you can identify that it's a bad idea for Nexon to implement things that can be used to be disruptive just prove my other point.
    Greta wrote: »
    Can't change channels or location, refuse to ignore it, probably just jealous or something (maybe a bad day?), won't admit that ALT button search does wonders and straight up thinks that such chair shouldn't exist, without agreeing that they look pretty darn cool and amusing in every way. In the end, they just feed the trolls.
    -People like OP in nutshell.

    I appreciate that you can identify possible causes for someone speaking out about something, but none of those are right. I just don't like seeing people intentionally being pricks and I'm asking why Nexon continues to make it easy for people to disrupt other players. Granted, you may not have been around during some of the events where everyone had to talk to a specific NPC during a specific time frame and for some reason CRTL+Clicking didn't work and you had to use ALT to find the NPC in a sea of names that keeps shifting about. If an event like that comes out while people have literal land-yachts to block the NPC, it'll be harder for players to locate and click the NPC.

    This thread is less about being mildly annoying with Melwyn and more about future events.

    Also, I never said they didn't look cool or that they shouldn't exist. Just that they shouldn't be able to be used near NPCs and such, just like you can't with other items (e.g. Campfires, Repair Altars, etc).
  • CrimsọnCrimsọn
    Mabinogi Rep: 64,210
    Posts: 8,868
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    edited August 25, 2021
    Oh I understand, I just don't care. They don't either. :trollface:
  • FluoretteFluorette
    Mabinogi Rep: 4,585
    Posts: 750
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    'kay, so I'm a bit confused
    Crimsọn wrote: »
    You know NA had to test this content before implementing it? Think about that. :D

    huh
    That whole post there. you pretty much just said what I was getting at. ¿Did you mean to point this at me?

    Necrojoker wrote: »
    I appreciate that you can identify possible causes for someone speaking out about something, but none of those are right. I just don't like seeing people intentionally being pricks and I'm asking why Nexon continues to make it easy for people to disrupt other players. Granted, you may not have been around during some of the events where everyone had to talk to a specific NPC during a specific time frame and for some reason CRTL+Clicking didn't work and you had to use ALT to find the NPC in a sea of names that keeps shifting about. If an event like that comes out while people have literally land-yachts to block the NPC, it'll be harder for players to locate and click the NPC.

    This thread is less about being mildly annoying with Melwyn and more about future events.

    Also, I'mma guess this was partly directed at me since Greta certainly say anything about time frames ¿lol?

    Is it hard? Quests feature a "Location Check" button accessible from the quest menu. With that you can see where the NPC is on the map. I believe the in-game map has a feature such as this as well where you can find the NPC based on typing in their name or sumthin'. Then you just have to walk over to them, following where the map is pointing to. If the NPC is obstructed by character models or objects, you can then press ALT. ALT will target the NPC regardless of how many players are there. It's not going to target other players. It will highlight their names and ​that's it. Click after using ALT while the NPC is targeted and your character should walk over to the NPC. If it gives you a message about being far away, step in a bit closer and repeat the previous step.

    It truly is up to the player to educate themselves on how to get around in the game. The game doesn't make it particularly difficult to learn how to do so, either.

    Now, if a player simply does not want to deal with the crowding (understandable-- my old PC would slow down badly with this), they can move to a channel where they will not find as many obstructions. There is usually one.

    Next, I don't understand why you're beating around the bush with this topic. You mentioned:
    Necrojoker wrote: »
    You're right, we should just ignore the misbehaving children, but that doesn't answer my question. If Nexon is going to put obnoxiously large chairs in the game, then why isn't there a "Too close to another object / NPC" stipulation like there is with other, less obtrusive things like Repair Altars?

    Then why not type up a proper proposal for this in Feedback & Suggestions¿?!¿?!¿?! Sure, okay--it may not ever happen, since there are few things you ever see implemented from those (plus I doubt KR would want to restrict how players can use chairs since creative stunts can be pulled from them).
    But hey! It would be far more productive than whatever it is that is hoping to be achieved (which so far, hasn't been) in this thread. Certainly, you KNEW that making a thread indicating "yeah, Chairs are problematic", passively aggressively alluding to certain individuals, passively aggressively suggesting badwill to the company, and tossing some insults would end up in backlash, yes? (and mind you, this backlash is a rather typical reaction to something like this one can expect on a common forum, as many as I've browsed). If not then Big Huh. :/
  • CrimsọnCrimsọn
    Mabinogi Rep: 64,210
    Posts: 8,868
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    Fluorette wrote: »
    'kay, so I'm a bit confused
    Crimsọn wrote: »
    You know NA had to test this content before implementing it? Think about that. :D

    huh
    That whole post there. you pretty much just said what I was getting at. ¿Did you mean to point this at me?

    Necrojoker wrote: »
    I appreciate that you can identify possible causes for someone speaking out about something, but none of those are right. I just don't like seeing people intentionally being pricks and I'm asking why Nexon continues to make it easy for people to disrupt other players. Granted, you may not have been around during some of the events where everyone had to talk to a specific NPC during a specific time frame and for some reason CRTL+Clicking didn't work and you had to use ALT to find the NPC in a sea of names that keeps shifting about. If an event like that comes out while people have literally land-yachts to block the NPC, it'll be harder for players to locate and click the NPC.

    This thread is less about being mildly annoying with Melwyn and more about future events.

    Also, I'mma guess this was partly directed at me since Greta certainly say anything about time frames ¿lol?

    Is it hard? Quests feature a "Location Check" button accessible from the quest menu. With that you can see where the NPC is on the map. I believe the in-game map has a feature such as this as well where you can find the NPC based on typing in their name or sumthin'. Then you just have to walk over to them, following where the map is pointing to. If the NPC is obstructed by character models or objects, you can then press ALT. ALT will target the NPC regardless of how many players are there. It's not going to target other players. It will highlight their names and ​that's it. Click after using ALT while the NPC is targeted and your character should walk over to the NPC. If it gives you a message about being far away, step in a bit closer and repeat the previous step.

    It truly is up to the player to educate themselves on how to get around in the game. The game doesn't make it particularly difficult to learn how to do so, either.

    Now, if a player simply does not want to deal with the crowding (understandable-- my old PC would slow down badly with this), they can move to a channel where they will not find as many obstructions. There is usually one.

    Next, I don't understand why you're beating around the bush with this topic. You mentioned:
    Necrojoker wrote: »
    You're right, we should just ignore the misbehaving children, but that doesn't answer my question. If Nexon is going to put obnoxiously large chairs in the game, then why isn't there a "Too close to another object / NPC" stipulation like there is with other, less obtrusive things like Repair Altars?

    Then why not type up a proper proposal for this in Feedback & Suggestions¿?!¿?!¿?! Sure, okay--it may not ever happen, since there are few things you ever see implemented from those (plus I doubt KR would want to restrict how players can use chairs since creative stunts can be pulled from them).
    But hey! It would be far more productive than whatever it is that is hoping to be achieved (which so far, hasn't been) in this thread. Certainly, you KNEW that making a thread indicating "yeah, Chairs are problematic", passively aggressively alluding to certain individuals, passively aggressively suggesting badwill to the company, and tossing some insults would end up in backlash, yes? (and mind you, this backlash is a rather typical reaction to something like this one can expect on a common forum, as many as I've browsed). If not then Big Huh. :/

    Yes.
  • NecrojokerNecrojoker
    Mabinogi Rep: 725
    Posts: 22
    Member
    Fluorette wrote: »

    Also, I'mma guess this was partly directed at me since Greta certainly say anything about time frames ¿lol?

    Is it hard? Quests feature a "Location Check" button accessible from the quest menu. With that you can see where the NPC is on the map. I believe the in-game map has a feature such as this as well where you can find the NPC based on typing in their name or sumthin'. Then you just have to walk over to them, following where the map is pointing to. If the NPC is obstructed by character models or objects, you can then press ALT. ALT will target the NPC regardless of how many players are there. It's not going to target other players. It will highlight their names and ​that's it. Click after using ALT while the NPC is targeted and your character should walk over to the NPC. If it gives you a message about being far away, step in a bit closer and repeat the previous step.

    It truly is up to the player to educate themselves on how to get around in the game. The game doesn't make it particularly difficult to learn how to do so, either.

    Now, if a player simply does not want to deal with the crowding (understandable-- my old PC would slow down badly with this), they can move to a channel where they will not find as many obstructions. There is usually one.

    Did you only read the part you highlighted? It's not every day that you see a post so obliviously pompous. Knowing where an NPC is located on the map is not the same as clicking them to start a conversation. Holding ALT highlights names, CTRL targets NPCs. Anyone who has ever tried to ALT+Click an item on the ground while doll bags are scuttling around it knows it can be a little frustrating. Now, instead of 4 doll bags and a couple of items, think about 100 names shifting about while you're trying to find a single one. It's like if Where's Waldo was an animated scene instead of a stationary image.

    As for CTRL+Clicking, per my previous message, there have been and still are issues with the CTRL targeting system so it isn't always reliable. Notably there were issues with it working during the Caravan and Legendary Weapon events. Both were time-sensitive and had people crowding the NPC. The latter event had one-hundred or more players crowding the NPC on each channel and the former was set up so you'd have to talk to the NPC after the event. Changing Channels in that case would forfeit your reward. And everyone has had a "You aren't close enough to have a conversation" message while it looks like you're standing close enough to slap the NPC.

    "It truly is up to the player to educate themselves."

    Fluorette wrote: »
    Then why not type up a proper proposal for this in Feedback & Suggestions¿?!¿?!¿?! Sure, okay--it may not ever happen, since there are few things you ever see implemented from those (plus I doubt KR would want to restrict how players can use chairs since creative stunts can be pulled from them).
    But hey! It would be far more productive than whatever it is that is hoping to be achieved (which so far, hasn't been) in this thread. Certainly, you KNEW that making a thread indicating "yeah, Chairs are problematic", passively aggressively alluding to certain individuals, passively aggressively suggesting badwill to the company, and tossing some insults would end up in backlash, yes? (and mind you, this backlash is a rather typical reaction to something like this one can expect on a common forum, as many as I've browsed). If not then Big Huh.

    Creating a topic in the Feedback section is a legitimately good idea. However, before I did, I wanted to create discourse with the players. Stating anything in a public forum is always going to be subject to trolls and childish behavior so that is to be expected. For better or worse, I've gotten feedback from players and that's what counts.
  • CrimsọnCrimsọn
    Mabinogi Rep: 64,210
    Posts: 8,868
    Member
    edited August 26, 2021
    Necrojoker wrote: »
    Fluorette wrote: »

    Also, I'mma guess this was partly directed at me since Greta certainly say anything about time frames ¿lol?

    Is it hard? Quests feature a "Location Check" button accessible from the quest menu. With that you can see where the NPC is on the map. I believe the in-game map has a feature such as this as well where you can find the NPC based on typing in their name or sumthin'. Then you just have to walk over to them, following where the map is pointing to. If the NPC is obstructed by character models or objects, you can then press ALT. ALT will target the NPC regardless of how many players are there. It's not going to target other players. It will highlight their names and ​that's it. Click after using ALT while the NPC is targeted and your character should walk over to the NPC. If it gives you a message about being far away, step in a bit closer and repeat the previous step.

    It truly is up to the player to educate themselves on how to get around in the game. The game doesn't make it particularly difficult to learn how to do so, either.

    Now, if a player simply does not want to deal with the crowding (understandable-- my old PC would slow down badly with this), they can move to a channel where they will not find as many obstructions. There is usually one.

    Did you only read the part you highlighted? It's not every day that you see a post so obliviously pompous. Knowing where an NPC is located on the map is not the same as clicking them to start a conversation. Holding ALT highlights names, CTRL targets NPCs. Anyone who has ever tried to ALT+Click an item on the ground while doll bags are scuttling around it knows it can be a little frustrating. Now, instead of 4 doll bags and a couple of items, think about 100 names shifting about while you're trying to find a single one. It's like if Where's Waldo was an animated scene instead of a stationary image.

    As for CTRL+Clicking, per my previous message, there have been and still are issues with the CTRL targeting system so it isn't always reliable. Notably there were issues with it working during the Caravan and Legendary Weapon events. Both were time-sensitive and had people crowding the NPC. The latter event had one-hundred or more players crowding the NPC on each channel and the former was set up so you'd have to talk to the NPC after the event. Changing Channels in that case would forfeit your reward. And everyone has had a "You aren't close enough to have a conversation" message while it looks like you're standing close enough to slap the NPC.

    "It truly is up to the player to educate themselves."

    Fluorette wrote: »
    Then why not type up a proper proposal for this in Feedback & Suggestions¿?!¿?!¿?! Sure, okay--it may not ever happen, since there are few things you ever see implemented from those (plus I doubt KR would want to restrict how players can use chairs since creative stunts can be pulled from them).
    But hey! It would be far more productive than whatever it is that is hoping to be achieved (which so far, hasn't been) in this thread. Certainly, you KNEW that making a thread indicating "yeah, Chairs are problematic", passively aggressively alluding to certain individuals, passively aggressively suggesting badwill to the company, and tossing some insults would end up in backlash, yes? (and mind you, this backlash is a rather typical reaction to something like this one can expect on a common forum, as many as I've browsed). If not then Big Huh.

    Creating a topic in the Feedback section is a legitimately good idea. However, before I did, I wanted to create discourse with the players. Stating anything in a public forum is always going to be subject to trolls and childish behavior so that is to be expected. For better or worse, I've gotten feedback from players and that's what counts.

    Yes.