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Real Talk: Nerf Chainz

Comments

  • AlignmentAlignment
    Mabinogi Rep: 720
    Posts: 19
    Member
    Rhey wrote: »
    After seeing the dan+combo card buffz 2 chainz I feelz it's time 2 do a reality checkz 2 this powercreeping...

    - Melee+Rng
    - Multipliers are 2 OP
    - All Single+Aoe skills are 2 OP 4 one talent
    - Skillz grants ADV(same as berserk's) heavy standerz
    - Spammable(Dorcha is 2 easy 2 generate)
    - Anything weaker than Rabbie phantasm or is not immune/HVSTANDERz 2 melee gets solo'd rekt easily.
    - Magic was nerfed cuz of similiar reasons once it got the revamp.

    It was fun while it lasted. Now it's time 2 balance it plox.
    Plz nerf. Not buff it even further w/Dan ranks.
    d2snfk0xeobji8gm2zz2.gif

    Feel free 2 discuss. :o

    Do you talk like this irl?
    GretaZeoSherriCoolAid
  • RheyRhey
    Mabinogi Rep: 10,175
    Posts: 1,499
    Member
    edited February 11, 2018
    Alignment wrote: »
    Rhey wrote: »
    After seeing the dan+combo card buffz 2 chainz I feelz it's time 2 do a reality checkz 2 this powercreeping...

    - Melee+Rng
    - Multipliers are 2 OP
    - All Single+Aoe skills are 2 OP 4 one talent
    - Skillz grants ADV(same as berserk's) heavy standerz
    - Spammable(Dorcha is 2 easy 2 generate)
    - Anything weaker than Rabbie phantasm or is not immune/HVSTANDERz 2 melee gets solo'd rekt easily.
    - Magic was nerfed cuz of similiar reasons once it got the revamp.

    It was fun while it lasted. Now it's time 2 balance it plox.
    Plz nerf. Not buff it even further w/Dan ranks.
    d2snfk0xeobji8gm2zz2.gif

    Feel free 2 discuss. :o

    Do you talk like this irl?

    Off topic. But I'll answer.
    Fo sure...If we're in an informal setting & post thingz rather than saying it out loud.
    :trollface:
  • GretaGreta
    Mabinogi Rep: 51,765
    Posts: 6,975
    Member
    edited February 11, 2018
    Nerf Dan...

    Nerf Chains...

    Players these days lol.
    ZeoSherriCoolAid
  • TheOthicTheOthic
    Mabinogi Rep: 1,525
    Posts: 52
    Member
    edited February 11, 2018
    Rhey wrote: »
    I just don't want other talents effort/req investments 2 be shat on without saying anything. :o
    Chainz wasn't a thing when devkitty was selling powercreep 2 other talents back then to make em gud just 2 disrespect all those investments made b4 now. :'(
    congratulations now you know how fighters and alchemists feel.gZJiY-xA_normal.jpg
    in other news /thread.
    Hardmuscle wrote: »
    W4dANyF.gif
    GretaJulieKysiraiZeoRadiant DawnMizukiHayamaHazurahSherriCoolAid
  • JulieJulie
    Mabinogi Rep: 3,930
    Posts: 340
    Member
    Rhey wrote: »
    KelpSoda wrote: »
    because powercreeping is a cheap way to keep a poorly designed game engaging and get you to spend again

    now invest another 30m+ on chainz until the next shiny OP thing rolls along

    ...
    62760418.jpg
    Greta wrote: »
    I don't understand why it's a bad thing. It meanz you don't need to invest ridiculouz amountz of gold to be OP chain slasher. Your fault for not realizing it earlier.

    I just don't want other talents effort/req investments 2 be shat on without saying anything. :o
    Chainz wasn't a thing when devkitty was selling powercreep 2 other talents back then to make em gud just 2 disrespect all those investments made b4 now. :'(

    welcome to my world
  • KelpSodaKelpSoda
    Mabinogi Rep: 3,035
    Posts: 286
    Member
    Julie wrote: »

    welcome to my world

    tfw pretending you dont exclusively play p2w powercreeping games just to have something to complain about later
    SylviaWolfe
  • ShadoeShadoe
    Mabinogi Rep: 3,090
    Posts: 241
    Member
    edited February 12, 2018
    Rhey wrote: »
    Julie wrote: »
    Rhey wrote: »
    Opalthira wrote: »
    Jazmyn wrote: »
    Demonic Infinite Bow:
    4ZaPohI.png

    Stinger Chain Blade:
    LYeRXKK.png

    Bow is only up to gem upgrade and chain has one blue upgrade stone... Current level 44, total 1367... I'm not knowledgeable on this stuff obviously, so I may not be seeing things everyone else who is more aware of how stats effect things... But I'm not seeing where a normal attack is like, 10k damage straight from the weapon's shop on a naked character.... :(
    2018-02-10_10.png

    r1 impale does 12k+ for me
    All my ap is in dex skills
    I am using the basic chainblade with enchants the event enchants on it.

    Here is sum moar pics 2 further drive in my point.
    Puppetry:
    Crit:
    vieert.png
    No-Crit:
    2yxrza0.png

    Chainz:
    Crit:
    311oqqd.png
    No-Crit:
    1zxboyx.png

    Weapons:
    2e5tovb.jpg

    Hardmuscle wrote: »
    I haven't said much here, because there's far too many people depending on the word Talent to bother talking about it. I have no problem with you personally, Rhey. There are certain people in this forum who seem to think that because I disavow a direct need to dedicate myself to any specific Talent for any amount of time, this means I don't know how to play the game I've been playing for nearly 10 years. We don't really need Talents any more so (or any less so) than we needed Destinies (a bonus is nice but it's hardly a need or a must have). All they ever were for was a way to get people more acquainted with skills they either couldn't figure out how to obtain, or found them to be too difficult to obtain. There are people who firmly believe the talent you choose at the start can make or break your character permanently, and from among those inside that thought train come the largest amount of trolls not worth arguing with. ~ If you're a noob and you're reading this; There is no such thing as make it or break it in Mabinogi. There is no such thing as forever failure because you liked the wrong 'predetermined set of skills someone chose for you'. ~ Don't ever forget it.
    Ofc my goal was not to tell people how to have fun or 2 be mocking those who'd like to be sticking to their guns about what skill set to use. Far from it. I am just reality checking chains to be balanced so that prevs investments made into other skillsets won't be worthless. Dat feeling when U spent hundreds of dollars and millions of gold and under perform against a 5k cardinal in ferghus's shop...leaves a bad after taste U know? :s :'( :o
    And I don't hold anything personal myself either against anyone who disagrees. It's kewl. ;)

    so cuz not enough $$$ was put into it, it needs to be weaker? :|

    Since all my investment made into other combat talent is pointless cuz "chainz"...can I get a refund on em? :o

    Sure thing. Right after I get a refund for all the pets I paid for that are only good for inventory space, since they're now giving them away like fliers for a garage band.

    And refunds for all the repairs I did on cars I no longer own irl.
    CoolAid
  • KelpSodaKelpSoda
    Mabinogi Rep: 3,035
    Posts: 286
    Member
    oh oh me too can i get a refund on my 2006 car since it's now pointless because newer cars came out
    GretaZeoSherriCoolAid
  • ShadoeShadoe
    Mabinogi Rep: 3,090
    Posts: 241
    Member
    KelpSoda wrote: »
    oh oh me too can i get a refund on my 2006 car since it's now pointless because newer cars came out

    Hey, my current car is a 2006! Did you just call it pointless? :O You'll hurt its feelings.
  • GretaGreta
    Mabinogi Rep: 51,765
    Posts: 6,975
    Member
    edited February 12, 2018
    Can i get a refund for all overgrown clothes i had, because i'm no longer a kid/teen and they are useless to me now?
    ZeoSherriCoolAid
  • bunny11bunny11
    Mabinogi Rep: 1,040
    Posts: 62
    Member
    edited February 12, 2018
    I'm not sure that it needs to be nerfed too much. I see it as more of a supplemental weapon.

    Most of what it can do, other talents and races can do better under the right circumstances and with the right equipment. I'm probably going to replace my Chain Sweeps with a Shuriken alt equipment set in most situations, once I grind out the STR.

    I do love Chain Impale but don't see it as OP. I wouldn't be complaining if some of the skills were toned down though. I just expect balancing updates to new content in multiplayer games by now.

    Maybe the real problem is that we just need more hard content like Rabbie Phantasm?
  • RheyRhey
    Mabinogi Rep: 10,175
    Posts: 1,499
    Member
    edited February 12, 2018
    Shadoe wrote: »
    KelpSoda wrote: »
    oh oh me too can i get a refund on my 2006 car since it's now pointless because newer cars came out

    Hey, my current car is a 2006! Did you just call it pointless? :O You'll hurt its feelings.

    Bad analogy.
    U own the car.
    U can customize upgrades to it if U don't like it's current state.

    Not so much with mabi(Legally). :* ;) :p
    Greta wrote: »
    Can i get a refund for all overgrown clothes i had, because i'm no longer a kid/teen and they are useless to me now?

    U bought a physical product.
    Mabi is a game(service).
    Not the same thing.
    :* :* :*
  • HellkaizerHellkaizer
    Mabinogi Rep: 11,305
    Posts: 1,066
    Member
    Opalthira wrote: »
    Jazmyn wrote: »
    Demonic Infinite Bow:
    4ZaPohI.png

    Stinger Chain Blade:
    LYeRXKK.png

    Bow is only up to gem upgrade and chain has one blue upgrade stone... Current level 44, total 1367... I'm not knowledgeable on this stuff obviously, so I may not be seeing things everyone else who is more aware of how stats effect things... But I'm not seeing where a normal attack is like, 10k damage straight from the weapon's shop on a naked character.... :(
    2018-02-10_10.png

    r1 impale does 12k+ for me
    All my ap is in dex skills
    I am using the basic chainblade with enchants the event enchants on it.

    So with basic chain blade and a clean highlander longbow, I do 15k and 8k with impale and magnum respectively.

    Things to note, I don't have dan ranks in magnum, magnum can be fired at range and shot nearly twice as fast taking a second to aim. Something else to consider, Bhafel set and CRX both have piercing and chains don't.

    Also @rhey an un-invested final hit probably out damages chain with infinite dorcha.
    CoolAid
  • TheOthicTheOthic
    Mabinogi Rep: 1,525
    Posts: 52
    Member
    edited February 12, 2018
    @Rhey I love how you're taking the time to answer these off topic or obviously joke replies but not answering serious criticism and better solutions than your "Nerf chains to make min/maxers of some previous talents feel good", like Ellisya and Lutetium.
    Ellisya wrote: »
    1. KR already did some balance stuffs for chain during test server to main server update.
    2. If you want to see more "Elf needs buff" thread, then let the chain nerf happen.
    3. I haven't seen a single thread about "Nerf chain" on other servers (other region)
    4. Chain isn't really broken. It's just other skill sets that needs buff, rather than nerfing chain.
    5. Enough of these thread, if you really want developers do something about it, then post it on Feedback section with reasonable/logical explaination.

    :3c
    Lutetium wrote: »
    ShouK wrote: »
    Might be because when I was training chains my dex is low and I didn’t use any related chain gears but... chain feels incredibly slow. Id much rather use kunai storm that can deal damage through waves than chain sweep. Kunai storm range 20 makes the AoE range similar to chain sweep. It’s also a pain to get dorcha each time before you’re about to do something. And having to normal hit high hp monster to gain dorcha, and risk getting hit back.

    This remains true with higher dex as well, having to farm dorcha and the very long drawn out animations for chain make it significantly slower than other options in many situations, especially when spamming missions such as battle for tail 2 or conflict where you don't have much of a chance to harvest dorcha, because even wearing special Eiren outfit with dorcha snatch master and level 20 dorcha leeched chain blade reforge is still only .95 dorcha per normal attack up from the basic .75 of having only rank 1 and no other boosts, which may seem like a fair bit but still gets burned through very quickly when you're using chain burst to maximize your damage output or anchor rush to get out of mob normal combos or close distance for impales.

    Personally I feel like chain is balanced very well, despite it seeming as if the damage multipliers are very high compared to other skills, the restrictions on using those skills from dorcha being a limited resource mid combat and the slow execution balance them out quite well, it's sort of like magic if magic were done correctly and had damage proportional to it's loading and execution time, big burst damage but a little bit on the slow side.

    While I don't agree chain needs nerfed, I do believe many other skillsets could use touchups. Fighter and Alchemy being two of mabinogi's darkest black sheep of skillsets are going to need a lot of work especially as both are borderline unusable in all but early game generation quests due to content rebalances that have happened over the years as they've gone neglected. Along with many bug fixes such as not being able to use a loaded and ready water cannon until the splash animation on the previous monster hit has finished (this happens even without vivace to speed up loading) and fighter's various position glitching issues.

    I feel like a more productive use of the bit of official nexon attention we can muster by posting on the forums would be better spent asking for bug fixes and rebalancing the weaker skillsets that don't hold up anymore rather than complaining to nerf the functional things into the ground as someone of the opinion all skillsets should be viable to use at all game points to at least a moderate efficiency even if certain skillsets are more effective than others in specific situations so no player has to feel like his or her favorite skillset is "useless late game" or otherwise :)


    GretaVeylaineZeoSherriCoolAid
  • RheyRhey
    Mabinogi Rep: 10,175
    Posts: 1,499
    Member
    TheOthic wrote: »
    @Rhey I love how you're taking the time to answer these off topic or obviously joke replies but not answering serious criticism and better solutions than your "Nerf chains to make min/maxers of some previous talents feel good", like Ellisya and Lutetium.
    Ellisya wrote: »
    1. KR already did some balance stuffs for chain during test server to main server update.
    2. If you want to see more "Elf needs buff" thread, then let the chain nerf happen.
    3. I haven't seen a single thread about "Nerf chain" on other servers (other region)
    4. Chain isn't really broken. It's just other skill sets that needs buff, rather than nerfing chain.
    5. Enough of these thread, if you really want developers do something about it, then post it on Feedback section with reasonable/logical explaination.

    :3c
    Lutetium wrote: »
    ShouK wrote: »
    Might be because when I was training chains my dex is low and I didn’t use any related chain gears but... chain feels incredibly slow. Id much rather use kunai storm that can deal damage through waves than chain sweep. Kunai storm range 20 makes the AoE range similar to chain sweep. It’s also a pain to get dorcha each time before you’re about to do something. And having to normal hit high hp monster to gain dorcha, and risk getting hit back.

    This remains true with higher dex as well, having to farm dorcha and the very long drawn out animations for chain make it significantly slower than other options in many situations, especially when spamming missions such as battle for tail 2 or conflict where you don't have much of a chance to harvest dorcha, because even wearing special Eiren outfit with dorcha snatch master and level 20 dorcha leeched chain blade reforge is still only .95 dorcha per normal attack up from the basic .75 of having only rank 1 and no other boosts, which may seem like a fair bit but still gets burned through very quickly when you're using chain burst to maximize your damage output or anchor rush to get out of mob normal combos or close distance for impales.

    Personally I feel like chain is balanced very well, despite it seeming as if the damage multipliers are very high compared to other skills, the restrictions on using those skills from dorcha being a limited resource mid combat and the slow execution balance them out quite well, it's sort of like magic if magic were done correctly and had damage proportional to it's loading and execution time, big burst damage but a little bit on the slow side.

    While I don't agree chain needs nerfed, I do believe many other skillsets could use touchups. Fighter and Alchemy being two of mabinogi's darkest black sheep of skillsets are going to need a lot of work especially as both are borderline unusable in all but early game generation quests due to content rebalances that have happened over the years as they've gone neglected. Along with many bug fixes such as not being able to use a loaded and ready water cannon until the splash animation on the previous monster hit has finished (this happens even without vivace to speed up loading) and fighter's various position glitching issues.

    I feel like a more productive use of the bit of official nexon attention we can muster by posting on the forums would be better spent asking for bug fixes and rebalancing the weaker skillsets that don't hold up anymore rather than complaining to nerf the functional things into the ground as someone of the opinion all skillsets should be viable to use at all game points to at least a moderate efficiency even if certain skillsets are more effective than others in specific situations so no player has to feel like his or her favorite skillset is "useless late game" or otherwise :)


    @First comment...I don't play in KR(nor can I operate on their forums 2 start a discussion) 2 address a (subjective)comment on the climate of this game(They do have updates/contents/Longer Lifespan than us) over there.
    @Second comment...U do know u can build dorcha b4 entering sm rite...?(Along with other workarounds 2 sustain chainzblading) But instead of making someone look bad and showing em how 2 git gud @ BTF2 or Conflict with chainz...I don't really have any contention with their point of buffing other talents.
    Lastly, I'm looking for other perspective in this discussion so if someone brings up sumthing that isn't 2 disagreeable I'd feel no need 2 address it.
    Till moar checks/balance is implemented...chain is OP(Eventually being broken when moar powercreep buff gets added without balancing it) and my issue about investments into other talent becoming pointless is still a valid discussion point.
    :o
  • JulieJulie
    Mabinogi Rep: 3,930
    Posts: 340
    Member
    Rhey wrote: »
    Shadoe wrote: »
    KelpSoda wrote: »
    oh oh me too can i get a refund on my 2006 car since it's now pointless because newer cars came out

    Hey, my current car is a 2006! Did you just call it pointless? :O You'll hurt its feelings.

    Bad analogy.
    U own the car.
    U can customize upgrades to it if U don't like it's current state.

    you can also customize upgrades in your equipment in mabi for chain skills ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
  • VeylaineVeylaine
    Mabinogi Rep: 4,050
    Posts: 348
    Member
    edited February 12, 2018
    Rhey wrote: »
    TheOthic wrote: »
    @Rhey I love how you're taking the time to answer these off topic or obviously joke replies but not answering serious criticism and better solutions than your "Nerf chains to make min/maxers of some previous talents feel good", like Ellisya and Lutetium.
    Ellisya wrote: »
    1. KR already did some balance stuffs for chain during test server to main server update.
    2. If you want to see more "Elf needs buff" thread, then let the chain nerf happen.
    3. I haven't seen a single thread about "Nerf chain" on other servers (other region)
    4. Chain isn't really broken. It's just other skill sets that needs buff, rather than nerfing chain.
    5. Enough of these thread, if you really want developers do something about it, then post it on Feedback section with reasonable/logical explaination.

    :3c
    Lutetium wrote: »
    ShouK wrote: »
    Might be because when I was training chains my dex is low and I didn’t use any related chain gears but... chain feels incredibly slow. Id much rather use kunai storm that can deal damage through waves than chain sweep. Kunai storm range 20 makes the AoE range similar to chain sweep. It’s also a pain to get dorcha each time before you’re about to do something. And having to normal hit high hp monster to gain dorcha, and risk getting hit back.

    This remains true with higher dex as well, having to farm dorcha and the very long drawn out animations for chain make it significantly slower than other options in many situations, especially when spamming missions such as battle for tail 2 or conflict where you don't have much of a chance to harvest dorcha, because even wearing special Eiren outfit with dorcha snatch master and level 20 dorcha leeched chain blade reforge is still only .95 dorcha per normal attack up from the basic .75 of having only rank 1 and no other boosts, which may seem like a fair bit but still gets burned through very quickly when you're using chain burst to maximize your damage output or anchor rush to get out of mob normal combos or close distance for impales.

    Personally I feel like chain is balanced very well, despite it seeming as if the damage multipliers are very high compared to other skills, the restrictions on using those skills from dorcha being a limited resource mid combat and the slow execution balance them out quite well, it's sort of like magic if magic were done correctly and had damage proportional to it's loading and execution time, big burst damage but a little bit on the slow side.

    While I don't agree chain needs nerfed, I do believe many other skillsets could use touchups. Fighter and Alchemy being two of mabinogi's darkest black sheep of skillsets are going to need a lot of work especially as both are borderline unusable in all but early game generation quests due to content rebalances that have happened over the years as they've gone neglected. Along with many bug fixes such as not being able to use a loaded and ready water cannon until the splash animation on the previous monster hit has finished (this happens even without vivace to speed up loading) and fighter's various position glitching issues.

    I feel like a more productive use of the bit of official nexon attention we can muster by posting on the forums would be better spent asking for bug fixes and rebalancing the weaker skillsets that don't hold up anymore rather than complaining to nerf the functional things into the ground as someone of the opinion all skillsets should be viable to use at all game points to at least a moderate efficiency even if certain skillsets are more effective than others in specific situations so no player has to feel like his or her favorite skillset is "useless late game" or otherwise :)


    @First comment...I don't play in KR(nor can I operate on their forums 2 start a discussion) 2 address a (subjective)comment on the climate of this game(They do have updates/contents/Longer Lifespan than us) over there.
    @Second comment...U do know u can build dorcha b4 entering sm rite...?(Along with other workarounds 2 sustain chainzblading) But instead of making someone look bad and showing em how 2 git gud @ BTF2 or Conflict with chainz...I don't really have any contention with their point of buffing other talents.
    Lastly, I'm looking for other perspective in this discussion so if someone brings up sumthing that isn't 2 disagreeable I'd feel no need 2 address it.
    Till moar checks/balance is implemented...chain is OP(Eventually being broken when moar powercreep buff gets added without balancing it) and my issue about investments into other talent becoming pointless is still a valid discussion point.
    :o

    you obviously meet some nice people but i'd rather not burden people so I can gather dorcha every shadow wizard run the key word here is speed, and that FHing GFS Spam and gunner/ninja have over chains they can execute( meaning they have long winded animations compared to other skills) skills a lot faster than chains can. and what I mean by every run is that people spam these missions past a certain point chains are too slow and you're a getting less gold per hour then if you were using gunner/ninja, FH,CC4 Firebolt and LRod/Blaze, CS/Magnum, or GFS.

    EDIT: I still use chains for these runs but not just them I mix them well with puppets and no I dont just use crisis I actually use act 4 and 7 because it helps the dorcha problem .
    EDIT2: second the example you gave was terrible.Act 7 is an AoE attack while impale is a single target attack, also you weren't showing Act 7s full potential as it can hit twice.
    ShouKCoolAid
  • ShadoeShadoe
    Mabinogi Rep: 3,090
    Posts: 241
    Member
    edited February 12, 2018
    Rhey wrote: »
    TheOthic wrote: »
    @Rhey I love how you're taking the time to answer these off topic or obviously joke replies but not answering serious criticism and better solutions than your "Nerf chains to make min/maxers of some previous talents feel good", like Ellisya and Lutetium.
    Ellisya wrote: »
    1. KR already did some balance stuffs for chain during test server to main server update.
    2. If you want to see more "Elf needs buff" thread, then let the chain nerf happen.
    3. I haven't seen a single thread about "Nerf chain" on other servers (other region)
    4. Chain isn't really broken. It's just other skill sets that needs buff, rather than nerfing chain.
    5. Enough of these thread, if you really want developers do something about it, then post it on Feedback section with reasonable/logical explaination.

    :3c
    Lutetium wrote: »
    ShouK wrote: »
    Might be because when I was training chains my dex is low and I didn’t use any related chain gears but... chain feels incredibly slow. Id much rather use kunai storm that can deal damage through waves than chain sweep. Kunai storm range 20 makes the AoE range similar to chain sweep. It’s also a pain to get dorcha each time before you’re about to do something. And having to normal hit high hp monster to gain dorcha, and risk getting hit back.

    This remains true with higher dex as well, having to farm dorcha and the very long drawn out animations for chain make it significantly slower than other options in many situations, especially when spamming missions such as battle for tail 2 or conflict where you don't have much of a chance to harvest dorcha, because even wearing special Eiren outfit with dorcha snatch master and level 20 dorcha leeched chain blade reforge is still only .95 dorcha per normal attack up from the basic .75 of having only rank 1 and no other boosts, which may seem like a fair bit but still gets burned through very quickly when you're using chain burst to maximize your damage output or anchor rush to get out of mob normal combos or close distance for impales.

    Personally I feel like chain is balanced very well, despite it seeming as if the damage multipliers are very high compared to other skills, the restrictions on using those skills from dorcha being a limited resource mid combat and the slow execution balance them out quite well, it's sort of like magic if magic were done correctly and had damage proportional to it's loading and execution time, big burst damage but a little bit on the slow side.

    While I don't agree chain needs nerfed, I do believe many other skillsets could use touchups. Fighter and Alchemy being two of mabinogi's darkest black sheep of skillsets are going to need a lot of work especially as both are borderline unusable in all but early game generation quests due to content rebalances that have happened over the years as they've gone neglected. Along with many bug fixes such as not being able to use a loaded and ready water cannon until the splash animation on the previous monster hit has finished (this happens even without vivace to speed up loading) and fighter's various position glitching issues.

    I feel like a more productive use of the bit of official nexon attention we can muster by posting on the forums would be better spent asking for bug fixes and rebalancing the weaker skillsets that don't hold up anymore rather than complaining to nerf the functional things into the ground as someone of the opinion all skillsets should be viable to use at all game points to at least a moderate efficiency even if certain skillsets are more effective than others in specific situations so no player has to feel like his or her favorite skillset is "useless late game" or otherwise :)


    @First comment...I don't play in KR(nor can I operate on their forums 2 start a discussion) 2 address a (subjective)comment on the climate of this game(They do have updates/contents/Longer Lifespan than us) over there.
    @Second comment...U do know u can build dorcha b4 entering sm rite...?(Along with other workarounds 2 sustain chainzblading) But instead of making someone look bad and showing em how 2 git gud @ BTF2 or Conflict with chainz...I don't really have any contention with their point of buffing other talents.
    Lastly, I'm looking for other perspective in this discussion so if someone brings up sumthing that isn't 2 disagreeable I'd feel no need 2 address it.
    Till moar checks/balance is implemented...chain is OP(Eventually being broken when moar powercreep buff gets added without balancing it) and my issue about investments into other talent becoming pointless is still a valid discussion point.
    :o

    They're supposed to become pointless so you spend money investing in new equipment. That's how the game works/how they make money. (That and fashionista.)
  • RheyRhey
    Mabinogi Rep: 10,175
    Posts: 1,499
    Member
    edited February 12, 2018
    Julie wrote: »
    Rhey wrote: »
    Shadoe wrote: »
    KelpSoda wrote: »
    oh oh me too can i get a refund on my 2006 car since it's now pointless because newer cars came out

    Hey, my current car is a 2006! Did you just call it pointless? :O You'll hurt its feelings.

    Bad analogy.
    U own the car.
    U can customize upgrades to it if U don't like it's current state.

    you can also customize upgrades in your equipment in mabi for chain skills ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

    But I can't ModUpgrade other talents so the current state of Mabi isn't so leaning toward chainzinogi tho. :'( :o :s
    + I don't own Mabi 2 do so.(legally) :/
    Veylaine wrote: »
    second the example you gave was terrible.Act 7 is an AoE attack while impale is a single target attack, also you weren't showing Act 7s full potential as it can hit twice.

    I was comparing the strongest multipliers of both talents(Since someone contested puppetry as being an OP talent on same lvl as chainz). Even If U wanna do aoe vs aoe chainz still comes out on top as act 7(and puppetry in general) haz enuf checks/balances. All my investment 2 make it gud will still be gutted against a 5k clean cardinal since chainz OPness isn't really checked/balance enuf in its current state. Outside of niche situations...Other talents would be pointless to invest(Or any past investments made into other combat talents will be moot) and just can't add up to the output of chainz. :/
  • TheOthicTheOthic
    Mabinogi Rep: 1,525
    Posts: 52
    Member
    edited February 12, 2018
    Rhey wrote: »
    Veylaine wrote: »
    EDIT2: second the example you gave was terrible.Act 7 is an AoE attack while impale is a single target attack, also you weren't showing Act 7s full potential as it can hit twice.

    I was comparing the strongest multipliers of both talents. Even If U wanna do aoe vs aoe chainz still comes out on top as act 7 haz checks and all my investment 2 make it gud will still be gutted against a 5k clean cardinal since chainz isn't really checked/balance enuf @ this point in time. :/
    Nice you didn't even respond to thier post of how chains are outsped by other talents or lutes part about the same thing :smirk:

    Also if this all about "investments" its probably not going to happened, why do you think I mentioned fighters and alchemists when bash came out pretty much all the dps of fighter PvE prevalence was gone all those "investments" oh how fighters put on thier knuckles and and all the drop kick uppercut and sommersault kick damage reforges, and guess what nothing has happened still. alchemists who spent probably over 40m back in 2011-2015 on perfect cres parts because back then people didn't spam sw like crazy as they do today so all three cres parts were rare as hell and good rolled cres parts were even more rare, not to mention all the water and fire alch enchants they probably payed out the ass for or spammed crazy like for flame enchants in peaca int.

    If you're only grief is that "investments" are being squandered, then change your damn title and your poll because obviously nerfing chains isn't the only solution and judging by the responses on this this thread its a very unpopular solution at that.
    LutetiumCoolAid