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Closed Statistical Debate Forum Regarding Race Imbalance
This discussion was created from comments split from:
Most Desired Revamp Poll.
EDIT: Idk why I'm the OP for this thread... urgh, these new forums...
I tried to split the convo from the old thread into this new one for you. This new forum seems to be a bit limited on what we can do compared to the old one so I apologize. Hopefully the entire discussion is complete in this thread though.
Comments
@Kaga Elf Skills and Stats pretty much fall into the old skills category. Hopefully a Racial Rebirth Revamp will also aid in improving the stats for base, skills, and races across the board.
Well it's mainly elves in general not just their skills.
"Elf speed" is for example pretty much useless compared to the other "advantages" other races have (plus we have fast pets, speed pots etc etc now anyways)
And range on pet is only useful for phantasm solo so..
I also thought when you said "racial rebirth" you literally meant "rebirth".
Usually when I say "Elf Revamp" I don't just mean make elves OP in archery. It's not just that.
IMO they should give elves new "skill sets" that they can be BETTER at than humans/giants.
They should probably update "Magic" for elves too and give them advantage in that.
I mean look at the renovation.. Humans got obviously OP FH.
On Magic Renovation we got Lighting Rod (Which is OP but can't keep up with FH) and on top of that ALL RACES can use it.
And archery? I don't even want to start there. The only thing that would make sense is if elves got some good updates in Archery Renovation and some nice skills that would make them as good as humans in their own ways. But they only got urgent shot, which is pretty silly compared to FH, dual wield mastery, Lighting Rod etc.
Not sure about the archery though, every class has something unique, elves can archer mount, humans can dual wield and giants can wield 2h with a shield so.. maybe if they gave elves something else exclusive I wouldn't mind humans getting mount archery.
Seems like someone is forgetting that not every elf is some kind of generic magnum spammer (archer)
I am no Archer elf so that "update/buff" is practically useless for me.
I also live in EU which gives me another range disadvantage.
I would love to see some more buffs though, like magic for elves etc.
Merlin update did buff mage yes, and renovation gave us nice mage skills (LR being OP)
But the main problem here is; Everyone can take advantage of the buff/revamps/new skills when it comes to magic.
I want to see something exclusive for elves considering they are also meant to be in advantage (magic) compared to humans/giants.
And even with that +400% Aim Speed elves will simply spam Magnum faster, the end.
Oh yeah, and like you said; It's Total level dependent. I don't see FH being that or dual wielding.
And on a seperate note, i'd like to see "Two Handed Weapon Mastery" and i'd also like to see Polearms in the game. This has been seriously long overdue.
Well good for you, because the new director is ready to do just that. He has buffed elves to be best in class archers (which in respect actually makes them highest DPS users), and soon will buff giants more because 10% melee damage wasn't enough to make them any better in the meta than they were previously (well, except GFS is still OP). First thing he says is he'll closely monitor and balance races as needed but so far it looks to be benefiting any race but human - goodness gracious. That's just great. And he did all this by listening to the feedback of Koreans (who can blame him, KR is the home country of the game).
Do understand that any suggestion is made moot if it's beyond the scope of implementation (I think most people here have already accepted that). As an example, a race change could be too hard to implement... Say you do get your idea pitched to a Korean dev who knows what he's dealing with, and somehow it's a viable change with little effort... It still has to make it passed the multiple devs including the director. I think we already know we're just making echoes here but... I wish we focused on efforts that would be easier to implement, especially in our localization of the game.
Are we trying to dawdle around and consider possible what-ifs? We're divided on those fronts because they haven't been implemented and we can't predict all the effects of any change that hasn't already been. Even if we reach a general consensus, it's not likely any sort of action will be taken (this game comes from South KR). I like a lot of the suggestions... but I realize what I'm reading so far composes of mostly wishful thinking. (We can't even avoid nerfs that have nothing to do with us, like VHM nerf and Saga 2 EP 6 nerf)
We've already skipped over an auction house, a ninja revamp, a VIP/housing/banking revamp, 20k ducat mysterious reforges (I'm sure people from other regions can add to the list easily)... and we have little to no discussion when it comes to these changes that are ALREADY present in the original country of origin (KR). Our 'exclusive' adventurer seal shop was taken and improvised into KR. Mission point was almost an exclusive, until it was recently done in KR. Seriously? Can we at least agree that catching up should be a priority instead of being divided on ideas that are likely to never see the light of day?
Maybe I'm out of touch with the community. Maybe I haven't joined in enough discussions to know the reasoning behind this. But I want to at least pose this question: Do you think your suggestions will last as more than an afterthought? (If this sounds condescending, I apologize in advance, I don't want to rub people off the wrong way but I had to eventually say something)
By the way, I'm not sure people understand what happened with FH. The skill received its first rendition of buffs at 200% damage and was deemed to not have any appeal in test servers. It was then buffed even further, until attractive enough for use, But it was obvious enough that it was appealing to the larger part of the player base (the humans). The new director is moving in favor of the other races but it isn't without its own backlash. I think race balancing is a complicated issue, and any suggestions we make won't have any impact. KR will decide this moving forward, as is the same with other servers. Only they have the resources to dedicate to such a huge task and thus' it is only fair that their player base (which is at least 10 times larger than ours and much more stable) gets priority in their voicing of opinions on the state of the game.
/rant
I'm still interested in what people want to say... but it'd be nice if we don't have fresh new ideas thrown into the wind every few hours, and instead focused on efforts that could make an impact. Unless I'm in the wrong forum for that.
Elves are the worst race at the moment.
Archery is only good if you live in KR or if you just magnum spam like any mainstream generic elf archer.
FH needs to be nerfed or they have to buff every other skill.
If it's hard to balance the races or revamp them, remove them all together and let everyone play as humans.
/Thread
-Again, this is all just assumptions based off of google translated garbage.
1) It appears that total level will now influence the bonus exp gained by training skills. (Another Possibility: Talent system may now have additional bonus training applied depending on the total level of your character calculated by every 100 levels.)
2)AP System: (I really didn't get what was going here, but maybe it's just a summary of the AP System itself with no changes.)
3) New Skills: The potenial system was updated (May be referring to the transfer to the Talent system, or a new additonal system altogether.) along with a few new skills that were listed.
***HOWEVER The balance between races WAS noted as an ongoing hot issue among the players in KR.***
(This means that the devs ARE in fact aware, and likely working in the background to find a fix.)
4)Level 1-100 is easier, not that large of an adjustment in my opinion. However, they did say it would be more comfortable to level.
5)Current Level of your Character is easier to see in the character information menu.
http://mabinogi.nexon.com/page/news/update_view.asp?id=4885027
[What that means for the NA Server:
New skills, easier to level skills, and a future race balance revamp. We can still upvote Racial Balance to a revamp we want to see happen right away, but keep in mind that the devs are aware and working on it. We just get to pester them about the statistics and when it's coming.]
I would love if elves could dual wield and use Final Hit. It's such an overpowered skill, as already stated in this thread. And it is odd how only humans can use it, giants can dual wield, can they not? Yet they don't get FH. I don't have any idea why elves are so "weak/dainty" that they can't use two swords at once, or even daggers. Sure Nexon tried to make up for FH by giving us Final Shot, but it is still seriously under-powered, and there was a whole thing where people complained elves could teleport with FS, but they forget one thing, FS Doesn't last nearly as long as FH, and teleporting takes away the time faster, so we can use even less of it for the little damage it gives us.
Even if being able to duel wield and giving elves FH is all we would get, I'd be pretty happy with it. I love to use the chef knives to pseudo dual wield, and have multiple to do so. Like it might technically one handed, but it is two swords. Even different sizes, and elves can use those. Why tease us and not actually give us the ability to dual wield?
If he can do it surely us OP demigod milletians can do it too lel
Currently there are multiple things improved, but they're all off topic until tests on the test server have been completed.
-New event
-Ability to fly in multiple areas that were previously no fly zones
-Teaser For New Giant Update (What that entails is currently just a tease, any changes in balance have not yet been stated.)